Camera Labs

Just found a full review of 650 (not sure if I can post link) and it scores less than the 7d -94% and the 60d -91% even the Nikon 3200 scores higher

Image quality is scored on par with the 60d but less than the 7d

texture on images at iso 400 and getting progressively worse beyond this

colour and exposure, images integrity retained up until ISO 12,800, sharply dropping 25,600 and say not to use cameras noise reduction if viewing large jpegs due to blurring

another worry for my use is that whilst the 6 fps continuous burst is met 22 frames at constant speed wasn't even with fastest card available -worse still raw and jpeg only 3 frames

overall other than the USP of the touch screen and focusing they don't get excited about as I thought reviewers would

You obviously know your aquarium better than I do, but if I may, the safe approach would probably be to do some test shots with the 15-85mm lens you already plan to buy and see if you need/want something longer and/or brighter.

Mark

If you are referring to the DXO mark thing, you have to understand that they only test the sensor, not the entire camera. If you pit the Nikon D800 sensor versus the Canon 5DIII sensor, the D800 wins hands down. But once you take the total camera package, the winner is not so clear anymore. Same thing for the 650D vs 60D vs 7D, each are good cameras and differ only by a few features. Up to you to decide which camera offers the best overall package for your needs.

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Cameras: Canon EOS Rebel T2i, Canon S90
Lenses: Tamron: SP70-300mm F/4-5.6 Di VC USD, Canon: EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS Lens, 75-300mm f/4.0-5.6 III, and EF 50mm f/1.8 II
Retired camera: Fujifilm Finepix s700

No this was a full review

that said I've noew seen one saying that the 7d focusing is horrible to use and a poor implementation and that the menu to access its control on the 7d less than intuitive - the reviewer saying the 11 point system in the 60d is better !!

Just do it But personally I'd wait for the Cameralabs review.


And others (you can probably find more of those) say it's much better than the 60D's AF.

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Canon EOS 500D + Canon EOS 5D Mark III
Canon EF 24-105mm 4L IS USM + EF 100-400mm 4.5-5.6L IS USM + EF 100mm 2.8L Macro IS USM + Sigma 12-24mm 4.5-5.6 EX DG HSM + Canon Speedlite 580 EX II + Nissin Speedlite Di 466

i would not believe it, because 60D has only 9 point AF...

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I'm new to DSLR's, so please be patient and take my opinions with reserve. Thank you : ) Yes, i am Canon man.
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Canon 60D + 15-85mm f3.5-5.6 IS, Canon 70-200 F2.8L IS II, Canon 430EXII, polarizing filter 72mm,
Canon AT-1, 50mm FD F1.8
Canon A430,

Maybe it was the usability of it rather than effectiveness

Jiko maybe not - but you could say my thread was nothing to do with the meaning of life more like what digital camera, shall I buy - testing times!!

If I had to choose, I'd go for the 650D at the moment. The 7D is a great camera but more expensive and then there's not so much money left for lenses, which are more important if you take a look at the images.

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Canon EOS 500D + Canon EOS 5D Mark III
Canon EF 24-105mm 4L IS USM + EF 100-400mm 4.5-5.6L IS USM + EF 100mm 2.8L Macro IS USM + Sigma 12-24mm 4.5-5.6 EX DG HSM + Canon Speedlite 580 EX II + Nissin Speedlite Di 466

I'm actually erring towards either the 7d or 60d think I'm going to pass on the 650d

I can get the main 2 lenses I want the 15-85 and 70 - 300 zoom with the 7d body so happy with that.

Back in store again yesterday stalked tha Canon rep who happened to be there and pick his brain got to play with both again but for longer and tried out the 60 with bigger heavier lens which made the weight difference feel less on 7d.
My only concern I guess is the af complexity on the 7 and lack of scene modes for initial hand holding until Im confident with it.

Perhaps some can explain how the additional focssing options on the 7 can help for action/ wildlife over 60d in simple terms please. I believe it would give me a greater % of in focus shots but will it be that great a jump.

If I canderstand this then Ill be in a better position to finalise my decision

Thanks guys

I honestly don't think the 7D's AF is that complex. Having so many points seems daunting at first but in just a day's use I felt it was extremely consistent.


Yes, you're right in saying you have a greater potential of having a higher percentage of shots in focus with the 7D but there's a tad more to it than that.

If you want to set the AF to work on a certain region of the frame, the 7D allows you to set the AF to focus on a cluster of points whereas the 60D only allows you to focus on a single point. As a result, the 7D is more likely to catch the subject in focus if it's in the same region as the 60D.

Whether it will be that great a jump or not in practice will depend on your settings and the subject. For motorsports photography, I'd put money on the 7D comfortably outperforming the 60D but with slower-action sports, I don't think there would be that appreciable a difference.

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Bodies: Canon EOS 550D w/ Magic Lantern
Lenses: Tokina AT-X 116 Pro DX f/2.8, Canon EF-S 15-85mm f/3.5-5.6 IS USM, Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 IS, Canon EF 50mm f/1.8 II, Canon EF 70-300mm f/4-5.6 IS USM
Accessories: YongNuo Speedlite YN-468 Flash, Neewer Macro LED Ring Light, Meike Battery Grip, YongNuo RF-602 Wireless Flash Trigger & Receiver YongNuo WR-128 Wireless Remote Control

I can't see me doing any motor sports but wildlife is an intention and possibly birds in flight but these will be occasional uses not a priority ones, but not sure if this is worth for the premium in price for the more advanced af on the 7d.

I'd like to think I'd be able to master the 7d but don't want to be disillusioned with poor quality images which means I get frustrated with the camera and wish I gone with the 60d which may mean I can consistently get good results.

As I see it I can grow into the 7d and the extra feature are there when I have the required skills to use them however no matter how I improve my skills with a 60d I can never add those extra features to its body

Image quality and focus speed, both of these are more determined by what lens you have in front of the camera than by the camera itself.
Especially since the 7D and the 60D were released so close to each other.
If you want to take the same lens and set up some test shots in difficult situations, you might be able to find a difference then if you know what you are doing.
Otherwise, I would not worry about it too much.

Go and pick up both camera and see what feels best in your hands.
Nothing will tell you how much you like the camera as much as picking it up and taking a few test shots.

I am still able to learn stuff on my XTi/400D, so I would not worry about growing out of a camera too much.

You can rent both cameras for a weekend and see what you like better.

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Canon Rebel XTi, BG-E3 Grip
Canon EF 16-35mm f/2.8L II, 24-105mm f/4L, 50mm f/1.4, 70-300mm f/4-5.6 DO, 85mm f/1.8
Sigma 150mm F2.8 EX Macro
Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 EX, Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 II
Canon 430EX II
Opteka 13mm, 21mm, and 31mm extension tubes

You won't get constantly good/better results with the 60D - or only if you invested the money you saved from getting the 60D instead of the 7D in a good lens. The image quality itself is the same in the 60D / 7D. The 7D offers more possibilties but it's not harder to use - there's just a bit more to learn but it won't take ages.

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Canon EOS 500D + Canon EOS 5D Mark III
Canon EF 24-105mm 4L IS USM + EF 100-400mm 4.5-5.6L IS USM + EF 100mm 2.8L Macro IS USM + Sigma 12-24mm 4.5-5.6 EX DG HSM + Canon Speedlite 580 EX II + Nissin Speedlite Di 466

You mention investing in better glass but I thought my selections were above average performers what in your opinion would be better quality options for the 15-85 and Tammy 70-300 zoom