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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:39 am 
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Hi folks,

The recent suggestion at NL that the newly announced EF 40mm f/2.8 STM would be a natural pairing with an adapter for EF lenses that Canon patented last year got me wondering why there has been such a paucity of rumours about Canon's CSC entry despite the possibility that the announcement may be as early as July 24th. So how about this set of features for starters:

  • 18.0 MP APS-C CMOS sensor
  • Full-HD movies with manual controls and continuous AF
  • 8 fps continuous shooting for bursts of up to 22 frames
  • Vari-angle Clear View LCD II Touch screen
  • ISO 100-12,800 sensitivity, extendable to ISO 25,600
  • Integrated Speedlite Transmitter
  • EF and EF-S lens compatible via an adaptor

Actually that's the feature list of the T4i/650D with just one omission (9 point AF), one change (8 fps instead of 5) and mention of an EF/EF-S lens adaptor. The AF subsystem on a CSC will obviously be different although the phase-detect AF pixels on the main sensor of the T4i/650D would be retained in my scenario. I've chosen to limit the burst speed to that of the 7D on the assumption that Canon will still not fully embrace the concept of upstaging its cash cows but I have assumed that Canon will position its CSC higher price-wise than the T4i/650D so they'll have to improve the spec somehow! If Canon do opt for an APS-C sized sensor then I think it's a fair call that the camera won't be the smallest (but think somewhere between the Panasonic GX1 and the Fujifilm X-Pro 1). Will Canon include an EVF on their initial model? I've no idea! Just for fun let's also, aping the E-M5 features, add:

  • Dust & splashproof
  • Magnesium alloy body

So, the question is: would you buy such a camera rather than a T4i/650D or even a 7D if the price was suitably commensurate with the specification above, say £800/$1100 for the body only?

Bob.

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OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 02, 2012 11:54 am 
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If I would buy one instead of a real DSLR?
Maybe, if I had the money and didnt buy that many cameras. It could be a great street photographer's camera, for its size and sound (no mirror).
But is it me, or is the market for enthousiast and 'holiday cameras for DSLR owners' growing enormously? If you want a bigger than normal sensor and a good lens (interchangeable or not), I dont know where you have to look for to be fair...

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Panasonic DMC-FZ18, Panasonic DMC-FZ28, Canon G5, Canon 350D, Canon 50D + BG-E2N
Tamron 17-50 2.8, Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM,
Canon 18-55 II plus lots of Minolta MD/M42 lenses and bodies


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 5:46 am 
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Bob Andersson wrote:
So, the question is: would you buy such a camera rather than a T4i/650D


For me, it would depend on availability of your proposed CSC and the T4i + 18-135mm STM kit. However, in reality, I don't think I'll wait for the CSC because my hunch is that it won't have an APS-C sensor.

Mark


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2012 11:48 pm 
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The indication on Canonrumors is somewhat lower and less interesting. G1 X sensor... and not a lot else.

At the end of the day, the question still remains what does this give you that other systems don't already? And does that fit any person's particular needs? Right now I'm not very optimistic it will be anything more than a rather late "me too" product, although since we don't know what it really will be there's still potential for something a bit different.

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Canon DSLRs: 7D, 5D2, 1D, 600D, 450D full spectrum, 300D IR mod
Lenses: EF 35/2, 50/1.8, 85/1.8, 135/2+SF, 28-80 V, 70-300L, 100-400L, TS-E 24/3.5L, MP-E 65, EF-S 15-85 IS
3rd party: Zeiss 2/50 makro, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300 f/2.8 OS, Celestron 1325/13
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 04, 2012 9:28 am 
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Hi popo,

I hope you are right. Canon certainly did surprise most of us with the G1 X so maybe they'll do it again but for sure they'll flop badly if they do enter the CSC market with a camera that is as sluggish as memory tells me the G1 X reviews suggested. :evil:

Bob.

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OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 4:40 pm 
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http://www.canonrumors.com/2012/07/mirr ... aps-c-cr2/

Latest news from canonrumors is 18MP APS-C sized sensor, presumably the same as the one from the 650D with phase AF on sensor. No more details. They are CR2-ing this rumour.

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Canon DSLRs: 7D, 5D2, 1D, 600D, 450D full spectrum, 300D IR mod
Lenses: EF 35/2, 50/1.8, 85/1.8, 135/2+SF, 28-80 V, 70-300L, 100-400L, TS-E 24/3.5L, MP-E 65, EF-S 15-85 IS
3rd party: Zeiss 2/50 makro, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300 f/2.8 OS, Celestron 1325/13
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:10 pm 
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So Bob, what would tempt you back to a Canon system?
That is if you can be tempted from your OM-D.

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Sigma 10-20mm f/4-5.6 EX, Canon EF-S 18-55mm f/3.5-5.6 II
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2012 10:56 pm 
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No, I couldn't be tempted. I've a good selection of m4/3rds glass with a couple more purchases planned and the E-M5 is easily good enough. Even if Canon announce a stormer of a body the new lens system will be very sparse for some time to come. And by the time it is mature no doubt Olympus and/or Panasonic will have produced an even better body. But I do wish those with EF lenses (who don't mind the bulk) a class leading Canon CSC.

Bob.

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OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2012 2:46 am 
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popo wrote:
Latest news from canonrumors is 18MP APS-C sized sensor

Interesting. If they also make it a multi-aspect sensor, I may have to rethink my plans.

Good thing I haven't been able to buy the T4i + 18-135mm STM kit yet - Mark


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2012 1:11 am 
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I have become defector. (No , not really)
I have purchased the Fuji X100 and I was so impressed that I also purchased the Fuji X PRO 1.
NO, I can't see me selling my Canon gear. Although my Canons haven't been out of the cupboard since I purchased my CSCs . I find the image Quality great and I because of the compact size I can carry both cameras around quite easily, not having the "bulk" of the DSLRs.
I'll wait to see what Canon comes up with. Might sell the Fujis and purchase a Canon CSC.

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Sigma 10-20mm.
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:04 am 
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Assuming the leaked pic is genuine, it looks to me like Canon cloned Panasonic's GX1 + 20mm f1.7 lens. Could make for a strong competitor to Olympus' E-M5.

Mark


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:37 am 
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Just hopped over to the usual rumour sites to see the pic too. Looks... unremarkable. Just another compact-ish body. Very crudely I'd estimate from the image a body width of 96mm, 61mm height to flat part, both excluding protrusions, and give me a good tolerance for error here! For comparison, my HX9V compact is 105mm wide 60mm tall. I think this is even small than the NEX models.

On that size body and styling, I wouldn't expect EVF. Maybe one for a future model.

A 22mm lens, assuming 1.6x crop factor sensor would give a classic 35mm length. If they used a smaller G1 X sized sensor that would push it out to just past 40mm equiv.

As the camera shows an "EOS" designation I hope it will work with EOS utilities, at least a near-future updated version to support it. Price and sensor size allowing, this could take over from low end DSLRs for astrophotography, saving the mirror slap and weight to be mounted.

Still, if the rumours hold we'll find out exactly what it is on Monday anyway.

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Canon DSLRs: 7D, 5D2, 1D, 600D, 450D full spectrum, 300D IR mod
Lenses: EF 35/2, 50/1.8, 85/1.8, 135/2+SF, 28-80 V, 70-300L, 100-400L, TS-E 24/3.5L, MP-E 65, EF-S 15-85 IS
3rd party: Zeiss 2/50 makro, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300 f/2.8 OS, Celestron 1325/13
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:05 pm 
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Interesting. If the sensor is APS-C, as seems likely from the aspect ratio of the sensor picture, then that speaks well for the IQ. But if the latest pictures at CR, which also show the back of the camera, are reliable then we have a camera body with ergonomics with much greater kinship to a point and shoot rather than a DSLR. So no OM-D E-M5 beater there, IMHO, but that's not to say that such a Canon CSC won't also come along in due time. The most critical information will be the details of the new lens mount as that will give us the best idea of what the new system can build towards in the future. We'll hopefully know a lot more next week. 8)

Bob.

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OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:54 pm 
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Yup, the sensor looks about 3:2 and if you compare it with the hotshoe, it is a bit wider which is consistent with APS-C size.

I'm not surprised this is a super-compact. Look at the NEX 3/5 which I believe is in a similar size class. There just isn't space for much of anything. This is not the bigger size class like the E-M5 or NEX 7 are. I don't doubt such a model will follow later though. But as it is a lower model as such, we have to hope it will be priced accordingly around the entry level DSLR ball park.

Continuing my comparison with the NEX, that I think is where the biggest fear lies. Hopefully Canon will do a better job on lenses than Sony did... This 22mm isn't that thin so hopefully that means it will do better in quality. I'm not holding my breath for a compact standard zoom either.

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Canon DSLRs: 7D, 5D2, 1D, 600D, 450D full spectrum, 300D IR mod
Lenses: EF 35/2, 50/1.8, 85/1.8, 135/2+SF, 28-80 V, 70-300L, 100-400L, TS-E 24/3.5L, MP-E 65, EF-S 15-85 IS
3rd party: Zeiss 2/50 makro, Samyang 8mm fisheye, Sigma 150 macro, 120-300 f/2.8 OS, Celestron 1325/13
Tinies: Sony HX9V.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 6:12 pm 
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If this is more or less the final product, would I be right in presuming that the EF-M lens mount will not be compatible with EF/EF-S lenses (at least without an adapter) due to the lens being closer to the sensor?

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