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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:20 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:45 pm
Posts: 11
Hi

After loads and loads of research I have finally taken delivry of my TZ7 today.

I have just taken some indoor shots and I am REALLY shocked at the results. I have attached 3 pictures for you to look at. They are so noisy and blurry. I took them using normal mode as Ai shots were even worse.

My previous camera was a Sanyo Xacti HD1010 and the pictures it took were much better and it was only 3.5 mega pixels.

Image

Image

Image

The last close up shot isn't too bad, but the others are not very sharp either.

Am I doing something wrong??

I have noticed that the photos don't show up full size and therefore you cannot see the full extent of the problem I have. Is there a way to post the full size images?

I will be doing some outside test shots tomorrow and will report back with those results. The HD footage indoors on AVCHDLite is awful too.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 7:59 pm 
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harters wrote:
...Is there a way to post the full size images?...

You can either link to them if they are available on a publicly accessible site or you can use some photo-editing software (IrfanView is free) to make a 100% crop (less than 1024 pixels on the forum but you shouldn't need nearly that much) which you can post at full size.

Bob.

_________________
OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:07 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:45 pm
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Thank you.

I have checked my uploaded images and it looks like photobucket resize them. I have tried IrfanView, but I can't make head nor tails of it.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:14 pm 
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.
I've edited your post to get rid of the quote. No need to quote the full text of a previous post: we are actively encouraging use of the Image button.

When an image is open in IrfanView just position the cursor at one corner of your desired crop, press and hold the left mouse button, drag the mouse to the other desired corner and release the button. You can then use the "Crop Selection" menu item (from the Edit menu) and then save the resultant crop via "Save As" (File menu).

Bob.

_________________
OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 04, 2010 10:44 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:45 pm
Posts: 11
Sorry about the quotes.

I'm not normally thick with programs, but I can't get the right pixel size for this site with IranView, so the best I can get are full size images in a Picasa album.

Pick a link from below and choose the download option to get the full size image.

http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/lh/photo/ ... directlink

http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/lh/photo/ ... directlink

http://picasaweb.google.co.uk/lh/photo/ ... directlink

THank you.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:10 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:03 pm
Posts: 15
Location: Pretoria, South Africa
Hi Harters,

I've looked at the full-sized images in your links. The first one shows clear signs of noise only in the shaded areas of the adjacent
room, but in terms of noise, the rest of the picture seems OK to me (my opinion). Perhaps not quite sharp, but the lens was at
full-wide angle. Note the ISO: 320.

The second one shows some noise on the dark wall of the adjacent room, and also in the main room, e.g. on the wall above the
birds, between the cupboard and the leather couch, and the cabinet of the entertainment system - even the leather in the left bottom
corner. Again, note that it was taken at ISO 400.

I can make out very little noise in the third picture. It is also quite nicely sharp - one can see some fibre details at the edge of the
cushion - even at the very corners/sides of the frame! I actually find this picture quite impressive. And, you guessed it: not
surprisingly, it was taken at ISO 100.

This clearly demonstrates why my countryman and fellow user dbnnet advises on limiting the ISO-rating (in his/her case, on the
FZ35, but the principle remains exactly the same).

The bottom line, which Gordon has written on the results pages of his views over and over, is this: the sensors of compact
cameras are not able to produce noise-free 100% crops of low-light areas at much more than ISO 80. Even ISO 100 shows some
noise in many 100% crops. So, ISO 200, and even more so, ISO 400 are only really usable for e-mail-sized pictures and small prints.

Another tip given by dbnnet: perhaps you could also try to increase the sharpness and saturation slightly (if these values can be
adjusted on the TZ series) - by all means, play around with your camera.

Good luck, and have fun! I'm sure that your TZ10 will turn out just fine, once you get to know it.

Regards,
Mark

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A good photo starts with a good lens.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 8:46 am 
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Posts: 11
Thanks for the reply Mark.

I understand where you are coming from when you say that the ISO rates are high. My previous camera only ever seemed to take pictures at ISO 80 or 100.

There is a setting in the camera to limit the ISO to 400, but I cant see a way of limiting it any lower, other than fixing it at ISO 100 for good. I am not the type of person who would know when and what to change the ISO setting to at any given time. I just want a point and shoot and that is what I thought the TZ7 was :(

I have noticed that when taking inside shots and it set to Normal mode the flash doesn't seem to fire when I think it should, so gives it a high ISO. When I switch to Ai it allways fires and has a lower ISO rating.

I love the wide angle, but the rest has really disappointed me, especially I am comaring the pictures to my old 3.5MP camera.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2010 9:50 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 04, 2010 2:03 pm
Posts: 15
Location: Pretoria, South Africa
Hi Harters,

I'm not that familiar with the TZ7, but if you haven't done so already, I'd suggest to consult the manual in terms of
1) limiting and/or adjusting ISO - perhaps there's a shortcut somewhere?
2) switching between flash modes.

If you are in normal shooting mode, it may well be that the flash will only fire if you change the flash mode to "forced".

In point-and-shoot operation, there are always trade-offs, e.g. higher ISO creates noise, whereas lower ISO requires longer exposure and runs the risk of a blurred photo. I suppose a noisy photo is still preferable to a blurred one, so most cameras will, by default, pump up the ISO when light is poor. This is especially the case in compacts, which have (a) smaller lenses that gather less light, and (b) smaller sensors.

(Sorry if all of this is known to you - not trying to lecture...)

Regards,
Mark

_________________
A good photo starts with a good lens.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 11:57 am 
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Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:45 pm
Posts: 11
I have had a few days to mess around with this camera and I am sorry to say that I am sending it back. Not for the quality of the photos, but for the problems I am getting in videos and some of the photos too.

Took it to London yesterday and below are some snap shots I have taken from some of my video clips. It happens whenever there is sun in front of the camera or near most kinds of lighting.

Image

Image

Image

Image

I have seen this on a couple of other peoples videos, but nothing so dramatic as mine. It looks like something from a Sci-Fi Movie. I have treid adjusting settings, different memory card etc, but nothing seems to make any difference.

It is a real shame as I LOVE the wide angle and if it wasn't for these wierd effects I get in video I would probably be keeping it. As it is I am going to send it back for a refund and purchase a wdie angle lens for my Xacti.

Any comments greatfully received.
Thank you.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 2:04 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jan 22, 2010 9:41 pm
Posts: 44
Location: Brazil
Hello harters !

Impressive how is bad this digital camera.
Good that you have return option and get back your money.
Here in Brazil no return of products.
Is not defective camera ? Strange for Panasonic product.

Good luck !


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 3:25 pm 
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Hi harters,

Glad you can get a refund but this issue is addressed in the camera's manual:
    Reddish vertical line (smear) appears during recording.
    This is a characteristic of CCD and may appear if subject contains
    brighter areas. Some blurring may occur around these areas, but this is
    not a fault. This will be recorded in motion pictures, but not in still pictures.
But yours are certainly pretty extreme examples and the manual certainly implies you shouldn't be seeing this in regular photos, as opposed to stills captured from videos.

Bob.

_________________
OM-D E-M1 + ED 12-40mm f/2.8, H-F007014E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 75mm 1:1.8, L-RS014150E.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2010 3:39 pm 
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Joined: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:45 pm
Posts: 11
Hi Bob

Thank you for your reply. I did read that in the manual and I have seen very small amounts in other peoples videos, but like you say what I have is extreme and personally I think totally unacceptable. In most of the videos I took yesterday the "smear" was visible and if they were part of any clips I had taken on a holiday I would not have been able to include them in my holiday DVD. I even had purple tinges in a couple of photos too.

Of all the video I have taken with my Xacti I have never experienced anything lilke that. When I got home last night I pointed the TZ7 at my overhead light and I got the Star Trek beam as I have nicknamed it, I then did the same with my Xacti and there was nothing at all.

I am really gutted at this trait, so I am looking to get a wide angle lens for my current camera as that is the only thing against it.

Thanks for your help
Harters


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 19, 2010 10:21 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:57 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Pasadena, CA
@harters

Same reason I returned the ZS3 / TZ7 as well. Went on a holiday to the Caribbean and had smearing in many of my video. Not only the single beam but also they wide ribbon of light as in your last 2 pics. One can hardly avoid the sun.
Even when cars are passing by and the light bounces off of them. Cant hardly avoid any of that. And I have even seen that at night shoots against street and other lights.
Very disappointing.

I also have a TZ5 which does not have that problem. So I guess its something with the CCD sensor and the MP crammed into it.
Was good until 10 MP and become worse with 12+ MP on same CCD size.

Looking to the Sony HX5 as an alternative or any other camera without that pronounced smearing.


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