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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 1:25 pm 


Last edited by Sublimity on Mon May 03, 2010 1:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 2:53 pm 
Sublimity wrote:
For consideration to others. There is nothing wrong with religion, but when badged publicly, it can trigger different responses, be it taking offence or eliciting prejudices. The point I'm trying to make is that the client is on top of the business pyramid in the sense that they are needed to made felt comfortable because they are giving you the dough. There is such thing as giving out too much information, this being the case.


This really is down to the photographer's discretion. While publicly announcing your religious affiliation may trigger offense or prejudices, it might also trigger positive responses as your customers might share your beliefs and thus feel that you'll better understand their needs.

At the end of the day, it really is down to the photographer to decide on how they want to market themselves.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 3:25 pm 
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pgtips wrote:
Sublimity wrote:
For consideration to others. There is nothing wrong with religion, but when badged publicly, it can trigger different responses, be it taking offence or eliciting prejudices. The point I'm trying to make is that the client is on top of the business pyramid in the sense that they are needed to made felt comfortable because they are giving you the dough. There is such thing as giving out too much information, this being the case.


This really is down to the photographer's discretion. While publicly announcing your religious affiliation may trigger offense or prejudices, it might also trigger positive responses as your customers might share your beliefs and thus feel that you'll better understand their needs.

At the end of the day, it really is down to the photographer to decide on how they want to market themselves.


+1 thats what I was getting at, just worded much better. Thanks PG tips, and apparently Gordon intervened while I was typing my post. otherwise I would have stayed out :oops:

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 5:18 pm 
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pgtips wrote:
Sublimity wrote:
For consideration to others. There is nothing wrong with religion, but when badged publicly, it can trigger different responses, be it taking offence or eliciting prejudices. The point I'm trying to make is that the client is on top of the business pyramid in the sense that they are needed to made felt comfortable because they are giving you the dough. There is such thing as giving out too much information, this being the case.


This really is down to the photographer's discretion. While publicly announcing your religious affiliation may trigger offense or prejudices, it might also trigger positive responses as your customers might share your beliefs and thus feel that you'll better understand their needs.

At the end of the day, it really is down to the photographer to decide on how they want to market themselves.


How about the middle road, that it has nothing to do with photography? :)
I just can't see how a religious photographer might take different pictures than one without. I honestly doubt religion will actually come up during a photography session. (unless you swear a lot, but that's a no-no anyhow)

I'm not critisizing you, I just can't see the relationship between religion and photography. Why would someone prefer a religious photographer, if the subject probably won't come up in the first place?

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 10:00 pm 
Citruspers wrote:
I just can't see the relationship between religion and photography. Why would someone prefer a religious photographer, if the subject probably won't come up in the first place?


It's not about religion per se, it's about getting on with the client. If you're covering weddings, baptisms, confirmations, bar mitzvah, etc you're covering a religious ceremony. A person who shares the same religious beliefs will connect better with you and you will get a long better. Let's take a different example, as the religion bit is a red herring.

Imagine that you're a band and you're after some publicity shots. You've got two photographers, both equally competent, have decent portfolios and are passionate about photography. One of them is also a musician, plays in a band, and is into the kind of music you're making. The other photographer, well he listens to music but doesn't play an instrument. Which photographer will you get along better with, and as a consequence be more likely to hire?

You get along best with people who are like minded.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 14, 2009 11:50 pm 
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Aha, very well, I can totally see the topic of music taste coming up in advance of shooting a gig. I just did not see that happen with religion, but indeed, I totally forgot "religious" events like weddings :)

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 4:41 am 


Last edited by Sublimity on Mon May 03, 2010 1:04 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:23 am 
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In my opinion its overboard as well, I wouldn't go that far but it is up to him. And I can't speak for JB, but if some one had a problem with his views, He'd probably rather not be hired by them in the first place

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 6:58 am 
Like I've said earlier, it's up to the photographer to make the call. I think you're overestimating how much people take offense at religion. True, a small minority might take offense at the mention of religion but I'm willing to bet that the majority of people will be indifferent and some will respond to it positively.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 2:52 pm 


Last edited by Sublimity on Mon May 03, 2010 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 3:22 pm 
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Sublimity wrote:
What is excessive and unneeded is the need to mention it at all. It is a business which maximizing client compatibility is a priority. Even if one did go by the naive philosophy "if they don't believe it, I wouldn't want to be working with them anyway", it makes one look peculiar and overzealous even in the eyes of clients who are compatible.

Yes, I realize that everything is up to the individual, but this needs to be met with modesty.


Are you his financial or business adviser? Didn't think so. He asked for design critique, you go off and start talking about religion. He's already said he's not running a business. and the "naive philosophy" you mention isn't what I was talking about. not if they don't share the same views, its if they are AGAINST the views.

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Canon EOS 40D | 28-135mm IS | 50mm f/1.8 |Vivitar DF 383 | Vivitar 285hv
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"Photography isn't so much about the results as it is the collective experience, your interactions with people and with the world"


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 3:32 pm 


Last edited by Sublimity on Mon May 03, 2010 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:17 pm 
Let's just agree to disagree on this one. Everything constructive that can be said has already been said and we'll just end up going round and round in circles.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 5:29 pm 
I'll give you a very personal example of a person who will be put off/offended by that sort of thing - me. Being a rationalist, I simply don't believe in god (at least not in the way a christian does, I guess) and if I read "we are forever thankful to god for giving us his son; our lord and saviour, Jesus Christ" I do indeed feel VERY patronized by the person who wrote it - in this example the photographer I'm interested in. I'll move on and look elsewhere the moment I see this stuff.

Putting something like that on your website states - in my opinion - "I'm christian, and you better be as well if you wish to hire me!". It has a very arrogant feel to it and I'd imagine it's the same for someone who's muslim, buddhist, hindu, you name it.

So unless your intention is to create the impression of you being a non-tolerant, overzealous christian, it's definitely not a good idea to put something like this on a photography website.

Right, as I might have gotten a little overzealous myself there, let make the following clear to you: I'm not judging you as a person, I'm just judging the IMPRESSION I get from your website. Also, I have no intention to offend anybody. If you believe in god, fair enough, I accept and respect that and I hope it's the same vice-versa.


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PostPosted: Sat Aug 15, 2009 6:09 pm 
Nostrum wrote:
I'll give you a very personal example of a person who will be put off/offended by that sort of thing - me. Being a rationalist, I simply don't believe in god (at least not in the way a christian does, I guess) and if I read "we are forever thankful to god for giving us his son; our lord and saviour, Jesus Christ" I do indeed feel VERY patronized by the person who wrote it - in this example the photographer I'm interested in. I'll move on and look elsewhere the moment I see this stuff.


Thank you for illustrating my point. I guess this might not be the case in post-modern Switzerland, but many weddings in the UK and in the US are still seen as religious ceremonies. If you're put off by God and all that stuff for whatever reason, can you honestly say that isn't going to affect the way you relate to the bride and groom if they're religious? Can you honestly say that if they came across a photographer who was just as skilled but shared the same religion as them, that they would go for the "rationalist" photographer instead?

This isn't an attack on you as a person or as a photographer (I've seen your work and the posts you've made, you're a good photographer and a helpful person), but at the end of the day people flock with those who make them feel comfortable.

Anyway, we're going in circles now and there's nothing more for me to say.


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