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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2009 6:07 pm 
acem77 wrote:
how much do you notice the rolling shutter/jelly effect from the rolling shutter on the cmos?

I live in the usa and wanted to get this at 1st until I read about the cmos really works and the rolling shutter artifacts.

Top reasons I wanted the camera
20X zoom
Use AA batteries.
Use standard memory card.
Stereo
1080p video
Hdmi video out
Now I am not sure if cmos is the way to go...?


Sony has a new camera coming out soon the Sony DSC-HX1
http://www.sonystyle.com/webapp/wcs/sto ... 1665789079

I wonder if the cmos will really be better.

It uses a Super Exmor CMOS Image Sensor.

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0903/09030 ... dschx1.asp
Setting it apart from most digital still cameras, which use an electronic shutter to achieve high speed, the HX1 unit has a mechanical shutter that helps reduce distortion when shooting a moving subject.

"Traditional CMOS sensor technology provides higher shutter speeds, but we are using what we call an Image3 system that combines the best image, sensor and processor,” said Karim Noblecilla, senior product marketing manager in Sony Electronics’ Digital Imaging Division. “By combining this sensor with a high-quality Sony G lens and powerful BIONZ™ processor, we are able to create solutions beyond fast speed that helps consumers get better pictures.”

pros
The camera will be $100 cheap and may have better cmos.

cons
Need a special battery.
Special memory card
9MP one less that the cannon


The DSC-HX1 has video capture of 1080p, but it is 1440X1080, which is 4:3, as opposed to Canon's HD, with a ratio of 1920X1080, which is true widescreen.


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 Post subject: Early Review SX1
PostPosted: Mon Apr 13, 2009 2:15 pm 
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Joined: Mon Apr 13, 2009 1:56 pm
Posts: 1
Location: Ireland
Interested in your initial user review. Purchased an SX1 and returned within a week for lens fault. I had an opportunity to take photos and video before it went wonky. Very disappointed with results. Image noise and colour fringing are unacceptable and significantly higher than I had expected. My main camera is the Powershot Pro 1 which though only 8mp blows the SX1 out of the water in every department. Definitely a good weather camera as saturation hides noise levels particularly in shadow area. Unfortunately here the sun does not shine as bright, as often or as long and using the camera above 100 ISO to compensate for poor weather, results in poor image quality. A very big Canon fan, I see no improvement over the SX3 which I used for 2 years. Due to the poor pound to dollar value my local camera shop tells me sales are falling off dramatically as you can now purchase an entry level to mid range SLR for the same price. Average price for SX1 is now $730+

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Lakelands


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 Post subject: Re: Early Review SX1
PostPosted: Tue Apr 14, 2009 3:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:03 pm
Posts: 34
Location: England
lakelands wrote:
Interested in your initial user review. Purchased an SX1 and returned within a week for lens fault. I had an opportunity to take photos and video before it went wonky. Very disappointed with results. Image noise and colour fringing are unacceptable and significantly higher than I had expected. My main camera is the Powershot Pro 1 which though only 8mp blows the SX1 out of the water in every department. Definitely a good weather camera as saturation hides noise levels particularly in shadow area. Unfortunately here the sun does not shine as bright, as often or as long and using the camera above 100 ISO to compensate for poor weather, results in poor image quality. A very big Canon fan, I see no improvement over the SX3 which I used for 2 years. Due to the poor pound to dollar value my local camera shop tells me sales are falling off dramatically as you can now purchase an entry level to mid range SLR for the same price. Average price for SX1 is now $730+


Hi,

Thanks for your feedback. It's interesting to hear your opinions about the image quality of the SX1, but personally I can't feel as condemnatory as you seem to be.

As you'll see in my original review, I have pointed out the fact that noise can be apparent in the 10 megapixel 100% images (more so in low light), but I also pointed out that if you view the images at a lower resolution, for example at 6 megapixel sizes, then the noise is rarely visible. What that says to me is that if you view the SX1 as being a 'good 5 or 6 megapixel' camera then you'll be perfectly happy with the results. In GOOD light and ideal conditions (or when using the flash) you can also get noise-free 10 megapixel images - but just don't expect perfect images at 10 megapixel resolutions every time.

Now... some users may obviously find that disappointing, but then it depends on whether you really do NEED that resolution. It wasn't long ago that cameras in this class were 5 megapixels maximum, and frankly I consider the 'megapixel competition' between the manufacturers to be just a 'tick on the box' in terms of stealing an edge over their rivals. Most users will find 5 or 6 megapixel images are fine for their needs. Indeed the highly rated (for an entry level model) Nikon D40 DSLR is only 6 megapixels. Now whilst that produces crisp images at 100%, it should be remembered that 100% is 6 megapixels. If comparing its image quality with the SX1 we should compare it with SX1 images resized to 6 megapixels.... which on the whole are generally noise free, and very good quality.

I'm sorry you had a lens problem too.... mine's be fine so far. And, as I've said in the review, the quality of the HD video is excellent - indeed, without rival in this price range. Given the 20x zoom, wider angle, RAW format, 4fps, remote, HD video etc.... surely these are advantages the SX1 has over the S3?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Apr 16, 2009 9:12 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:10 pm
Posts: 14
edovie wrote:
The DSC-HX1 has video capture of 1080p, but it is 1440X1080, which is 4:3, as opposed to Canon's HD, with a ratio of 1920X1080, which is true widescreen.


Wow did not notice that bummer well that kills the deal for the sony in my book. non wide screen 1080p thats just wrong.

the only thing that has me worried is the rolling shutter effect.
ill have to wait till i can test a camera at a brick and mortar store


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 2:47 pm 
Yeah. Still, there is one benefit to the DSC-HX1's video: it's MPEG-4, unlike the SX1, which is MOV, which is Apple QuickTime specific (you can play it on a Windows comp., you need QuickTime though)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 4:55 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:10 pm
Posts: 14
1440 x 1080 v 1920 x 1080
This got me thinking here is a good post about it.

http://www.dvinfo.net/conf/general-hd-7 ... 080-a.html


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 5:42 pm 
So which PhD ("Press here, Dummy!" - i.e., a Point-and-Shoot) are you going to get?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Apr 17, 2009 8:48 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:10 pm
Posts: 14
not sure thats the problem.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 19, 2009 1:06 pm 
Ah... you're not sure if complementary metal-oxide semiconductor is the way to go?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 21, 2009 5:51 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 16, 2009 6:10 pm
Posts: 14
yea i am not sure about cmos sensors yet.

How long do the batteries last when recording HD videos?
Some place said 5min? hope that’s not true.

Does the new firmware let you select 720p or any extra video formats , lower bitrates ect..?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 9:53 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 12:03 pm
Posts: 34
Location: England
acem77 wrote:
yea i am not sure about cmos sensors yet.

How long do the batteries last when recording HD videos?
Some place said 5min? hope that’s not true.

Does the new firmware let you select 720p or any extra video formats , lower bitrates ect..?


Sorry.... it's been a while since I was on here. So... in reply.

I use rechargeable batteries on my SX1 and currently they are only 1700mah. I need to get some 2700 for best time, but 1700 ones have been OK so far.

You can definitely shoot much more than 5 mins with those. I did a day trip in which I did lots of different full HD shots, and lots of stills, and my batteries eventually ran out. But I'd shot around 15 mins of video in total and 100 or so stills I think. So that should give you a good idea (power is obviously used up by all the zooming in and out, turning on and off, using the LCD screen all the time etc.... so I'm sure longer times could have been achieved on those batteries if I'd done fewer still shots, concentrated only on video etc).

I'd say with a good set of 2700 batteries you should be able to get between 20 and 30 mins of shooting - maybe longer. And if you ensure you take 2 sets of batteries on a day out you can change when the 1st set expire.

Regarding the firmware update - no the only change is addition of RAW still format handling. Video is unchanged, and remains at 1080p at 43Mbps (or so). But you can convert down to 720p etc when you put it on to your PC, so don't be put off by that. The only real 'problem' with it is the limit on space on the SDHC card etc. But ultimately I'd prefer to shoot the video at the best quality, and have that as my source material which I can save for years to come, and then simply 'downgrade' the quality on my PC to 720p for the present for my edited results. When PC speeds, and storage capacities increase I'll then be able to re-use my original 1080p footage and make the most of it at 1080p again one day.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2009 10:16 am 
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Location: UK
Hi folks,

This thread was suffering from pandemic "quote-itis". :roll: In particular a number of posts were direct replies to the previous post in the sequence but quoted the full text of that previous post. In one glaring example the quotes got nested three deep.

So I've done a spot of "quote pruning", but only in those posts where the context is immediately obvious. My only motivation was to improve the readability of the thread so I hope you approve. Various posts from three members were affected.

I don't want this post to drag PatientLearner's review thread off-topic (start a new thread in the Comments and feedback or PM me if you think I've acted wrongly) but I wanted to do you the courtesy of letting you know what happened.

Bob.

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OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue May 19, 2009 10:47 pm 
Hi acem77!

Here are CNET's reviews for the two cameras:

Canon PowerShot SX1 IS
Sony Cyber-shot DSC-HX1


As Gordon doesn't have a DSC-HX1 review, here's a side-by-side:
http://reviews.cnet.com/4504-4_7-0.html?id=33543458&id=33529061&&tag=boxcoco


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