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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2009 5:44 am 
'll give you a little trick about noise reduction after the fact (it appears this is what some brands might be doing in camera by default--the problem is you can't put the detail back in the shadows later). High ISO noise makes an image look like the blacks are "smoky." If your post-processing software has a Tonal Curve option, put your cursor on the bottom of the 45 degree line and give it a tiny tug downward. This pulls the dark values a tad deeper and cleans up the smokiness and leaves the other tonal values alone. Tonal Curves are cool as long as you don't get carried away (like most post-processing tools).
I only have an early version of Elements on this computer that doesn't have curves.
When you open a Tonal Curve tool you see a box with a line running from the lower left corner up to the upper right corner. This is called gamma and a 45 degree line is a gamma (contrast) value of 1.0. The bottom left end of the line are the darkest values, the middle of the line are the midtones and the upper right end of the line are the highest highlight values.
In Tonal curves you can move the gamma locally up and down by placing the cursor on the line and pulling by holding down the left mouse key and dragging the line with the cursor and then letting go of the mouse button. This way you change the gamma in a specific area and leave the rest of the values alone. You should also be able to do this with the RGB color channels--this is how Hue and Saturation work in Photoshop.
Pulling the lower left end of the gamma curve downward deepens the dark (shadow) values and effectively hides noise. The benefit of Olympus letting you set the level of noise filtration or not using it at all is that if the shot is that good, you can very subtly control how much tonal curve you want to apply, whereas with other brands it is done automatically and pushes down shadow detail that can't be recovered in post-processing (plus the degree to which the shadows are being pushed down cannot be controlled).

Regards,
Mike
Olympus Imaging Am


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PostPosted: Fri May 08, 2009 5:50 am 
Apparently, after asking questions concerning the noise level in the new cameras as illustrated on this website the answer was,

I monitor the Internet forums for Olympus and I am constantly amazed at how many experts are out there.

and:

post-processing software has a Tonal Curve option


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PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 11:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 08, 2005 3:32 pm
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Location: Queenstown, New Zealand
Hi everyone, I've just posted High ISO samples comparing the Canon EOS 500D / T1i, Nikon D5000 and Olympus E-620 here:

Canon 500D / T1i vs Nikon D5000 vs Olympus E-620 High ISO shoot-out!!

Be interested to hear what you think...

Gordon


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PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 7:00 am 
Gordon Laing wrote:
Hi everyone, I've just posted High ISO samples comparing the Canon EOS 500D / T1i, Nikon D5000 and Olympus E-620 here:

Canon 500D / T1i vs Nikon D5000 vs Olympus E-620 High ISO shoot-out!!

Be interested to hear what you think...

Gordon


Disappointed. Look at that Nikon; at ISO3200, its sample looks better than ISO800 for the E-620.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 7:21 am 
Ditto. I'm beginning to think that 10 megapixel is the upper limit for 4/3 sensors.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 7:53 am 
Armanius wrote:
Ditto. I'm beginning to think that 10 megapixel is the upper limit for 4/3 sensors.


Well its all about pixels per inch. It seems Olympus got ahead of themselves and pushed their sensors a bit too hard when squeezing in 12MP whilst their technology may not have necessarily advanced enough to allow so many ppi to an acceptable degree of success.

Its all a numbers game with cameras, and if the APS-C cameras are all in the 14MP pixel range, who's going to want to buy a 10MP camera? Can you really convince some buyers that MP aren't all that important?

So the choice to have 12MP in the 620 makes sense, whether we like it or not; however why its in the E-30 is beyond me. Then again, the existence of the E-30 is beyond me.


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PostPosted: Sat May 16, 2009 9:25 pm 
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While it may be true that 12 mpixels could be pushing Four Thirds a little far, I think the 15 Mpixels (without gapless microlenses) on the 500D / T1i also isn't doing Canon few favours. Looks like Nikon got a good balance though with the D90 / D5000 sensor...


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PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 2:29 am 
Gordon Laing wrote:
While it may be true that 12 mpixels could be pushing Four Thirds a little far, I think the 15 Mpixels (without gapless microlenses) on the 500D / T1i also isn't doing Canon few favours. Looks like Nikon got a good balance though with the D90 / D5000 sensor...


If an Enthusiust is focussed on only High ISO, then Nikon, Canon will "win" everytime....why go 12 on the E620/E30...

Atomic....why E30 ?....its one sweet piece of camera to use with nothing to complain about up to ISO 800. An even ISO 1600 is beyond good if you shot RAW and PP.

Noise is "better" on E3....if you don't mind banding at ISO 1600.
E30...better DR....no banding...slightly noisier than E3 which will bother you if you print say.....21"x24" at ISO 1600.

I would bet the "E4" will have the same gorilla body of the E3 and a sensor that has the DR of the E30 with the noise of the E3.....but then what will Oly users complain about....probably the weight !

The 12 MP sensor and imaging pipeline on the E620/E30 is huge progress for Olympus after the disappointing DR and high ISO performance of the
EX10, E3 & EX20 cameras.

Most Pro Photographers though will probaly always stick with Canon & Nikon APS-C or there abouts, because staring at incredibly blown up pixel level high ISO noise samples means something to them.

Oly owners are sure a hard lot to please.
:roll:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 4:10 am 
LJohnK wrote:
Oly owners are sure a hard lot to please.
:roll:


That's b/c we are the best!! :)


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 4:34 am 
Armanius wrote:
LJohnK wrote:
Oly owners are sure a hard lot to please.
:roll:


That's b/c we are the best!! :)




Why Yes....we are !!! :lol:


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 Post subject: Review for E620
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 5:17 am 
Here's a new review of the E620 from another site. The samples up to ISO800 were not bad. And the reviewer liked the images up to 800, as some other reviewers did on other sites. I keep wondering if I am being overly critical ...


http://www.digitalcamerareview.com/default.asp?newsID=3991&review=olympus+e620


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 6:36 am 
LJohnK wrote:
Atomic....why E30 ?....its one sweet piece of camera to use with nothing to complain about up to ISO 800. An even ISO 1600 is beyond good if you shot RAW and PP.


I have no doubt that its a good camera, I just don't quite understand why it exists. Its just too close to the E3 in specification. Though I still maintain that the E3 has a better sensor.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 6:58 am 
Atomic wrote:
LJohnK wrote:
Atomic....why E30 ?....its one sweet piece of camera to use with nothing to complain about up to ISO 800. An even ISO 1600 is beyond good if you shot RAW and PP.


I have no doubt that its a good camera, I just don't quite understand why it exists. Its just too close to the E3 in specification. Though I still maintain that the E3 has a better sensor.


It's for people like me that don't want to carry around heavy stuff. The E-3 might have advantages if you shoot in the desert or in some other exotic locations, but that is nothing that would improve my day to day photography.

Yes, the E-30 basically is the E-3 with less weight. I love it


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 10:42 am 
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Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2007 11:10 pm
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Location: Netherlands
The results are more or less what could be expected and like what we have seen with the D90/50D/E30 (or E620). The D5000 does best in high iso and the E620 worst. The canon is in between, but maybe a little closer to the Olympus.

I still think that all 3 are perfectly usable till iso 800 and often till iso 1600 as well. So is Canon going too far? That depends on your type of photography. Most people will probably use less then iso 400 in 95% of their pictures and might use iso 1600 or higher in only 1% of their pictures, especially considering stabilization, which is built in most camera's and kit lenses nowadays.
So in most of the photo's Canon will give more detail and in some photo's not. Of course you need a better lens then the kit lens to benefit from this.

Olympus is just going as far as they can go without compromising too much on high iso noise performance.

Hans

_________________
Olympus E-M5, 9-18, 12-50, 25 f1.8, 45 f1.8, 12-60, 40-150, 70-300


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PostPosted: Sun May 17, 2009 4:45 pm 
I'm intrigued why a lot of messages in a variety of forums say that most people don't shoot high ISO. Do people not take photos at night? Or when there isn't optimum lighting conditions such as indoors? In my opinion, making excuses for Oly's high ISO deficiencies based on a perception that most people don't use high ISO doesn't quite jive. I often find myself taking photos using ISO800 (and sometimes higher), because I need a faster shutter speed. Am I the exception? As an Oly user, it seems like we have the best glass out of any system. But wouldn't it be nice to have a sensor that can provide great results under ALL lighting conditions? C'mon Oly, you can do it!! :)


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