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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 4:21 pm 
Hello All,
First post as DSLR newbie. I was, for many years, a film slr (Maxxum) user. Now venturing into DSLR. Throughout the film years, vibration control was managed by shutter speed, mlu, tripod, etc.
This may seem a very elementary question but here it goes..Why is anti-shake /vibration control such a needed feature on dslr systems? Thanks for all your help.
arthurk


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 4:39 pm 
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Hi Arthur,

May I wish you a warm welcome to the CameraLabs forums.

As you rightly point out, we managed without IS/VR for years and, in any event, IS/VR doesn't help freeze motion and often has to be switched off when panning or when the camera is mounted on a tripod. With suitable subject matter it can be a boon, though, enabling you to hand-hold shots that might otherwise have needed a tripod or an optimistically high ISO to avoid camera shake induced blurring.

Bob.

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Olympus OM-D E-M1 + M.Zuiko Digital ED 12-40mm f/2.8, Lumix 7-14mm f/4, Leica DG Summilux 15mm f/1.7 ASPH, M.Zuiko Digital 45mm 1:1.8, M.Zuiko Digital ED 75mm 1:1.8.
Leica D Vario-Elmar 14mm-150mm f/3.5 - f/5.6 ASPH.
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Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 4:59 pm 
Hi arthurk,

let me join Bob in wishing you a warm welcome to the forums!

Personally I think that VR/IS is the best thing since sliced bread, photographically speaking. That and the ability to handle higher ISO without too much noise, suddenly makes it easier and faster to shoot images under less than idea conditions and still get something favorable out of it.

Suddenly, dimly or murkily lit interiors have come possible to shoot without tripods, thus allowing for more candid shooting.

Cheers :-)


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 5:20 pm 
It's about options. IS usually allows you an extra 2 - 3 stops to work with allowing you to use a lower ISO than you would without it. This works great in low light conditions, and I've found it helpful when zooming without a tripod.

Of course, if you're a pro you probably have much steadier hands than me :) Still, IS will be helpful.


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 6:32 pm 
Welcome,

From my experiences with DSLR's in the past year IS/VR is a superb addition to a camera setup. If you are having trouble with getting properly sharp images all the time or don't like lugging a tripod everywhere (like me) then IS is a great thing to have.

I recommend it!


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 6:46 pm 
I've had a brief spell with VR on my old 18-200 lens. It's probably one of those things you don't really notice, it kind of just does its thing in the background and when you don't have it, that's when you miss it.

I get my Nikon D300 today, and have replaced my 18-200 with a number of primes so I'm hoping that the combination of the faster lenses with the D300's ability to work at higher ISOs should pretty much even out not having VR. It remains to be seen though!


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PostPosted: Wed May 21, 2008 11:13 pm 
Thanks for the welcome and all the insightful responses to my query. It appears the IS/VR feature is , indeed, a welcome adjunct to be used selectively in producing sharp images.

I guess my next research is whether or not I should start with lens IS/VR or select the camera body IS/VR system! The game is afoot.

Thanks again.
Arthur


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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 3:26 pm 
Hello folks,
Coupled with the generous counsel from many of you, my previous life (read that lenses) in the Minolta Maxxum world, and some hands on encounters with the Canon xsi and Sony Alpha 300, I have decided to go with Sony. I now am trying to learn and practice with the Alpha300, kit 18-70 zoom and Sony 18-250 zoom (may be my walk around lens), prior to trying my other Minolta lenses. Thanks again.
Art Kuperstein


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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 5:10 pm 
Great stuff Art!!!

Do feel free to post some of your images on the forum!!! :P

Mark


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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 7:24 pm 
Hi.

Three weeks ago I purchased a slightly less ambitious superzoom camera. Coming from a 3x zoom compact(ish) p&s an 18x zoom camera (Fuji S8000fd) is a big step up. With all that it tries to do and in such a compact format inevitably it has to compromise on several points but all in all it's a pretty good compromise I think. The challenge is to coax as good as possible photographs from this little contraption. So far I am not unhappy.

As you can imagine the zoom gets a lot of exercise and the IS is basically always on. I have been wondering about this feature too. Although it has proven to help me make handheld shots that otherwise would have been impossible I do wonder whether in certain situations it also might prevent you from getting the maximum achievable sharpness. After all, although it in theory counteracts the camera movement it in itself creates movement too by the very nature of the thing.

First of all I'd like to know whether the IS is always active if it is switched on even when the exposure time in itself is short enough to guarantee a sharp image. I don't think the manual tells me about this. Will it inactivate itself when the shutter speed gets below a certain value?

Is it possible that with a short exposure a simultaneous movement of the sensor (which is the type of IS in my camera) can actually prevent maximum sharpness? Not that it will create what the average viewer will call unsharp pictures. On the contrary. The image will look sharp within the expectation of most observers but can it be that without it in certain conditions a photo can actually be sharper than with it?

What I haven't tried yet but do wonder about is whether a photo taken from a tripod without IS could/would be sharper than the same photo shot handheld with IS well within the capabilities of the IS so the handheld photo would be (considered) sharp. In other words. If you want maximum sharpness is it perhaps better to use a tripod even when the IS is supposed to be able to handle the motion unsharpness?

And will a photo taken with a tripod with IS always be (at least) as sharp as one taken from a tripod without IS or can a photo taken with IS from a tripod in certain situations be less sharp than when taken without IS?

Has this been investigated with some thoroughness? Does anyone here know about this?

Ben.


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PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 10:30 pm 
I think if you have something like my Canon 40D with Battery Grip with 2 batteries installed and attached to my EF 100-400 L IS USM lens with tripod ring left on and extended to 400mm and hand held weighs in at a total of 2.739Kg... then I would say yes it's an absolute must


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PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 8:11 am 
Hello arthur and welcome to the forums :)

Not to forget, breathing techniques also help! But of course IS/VR(/SSS) are very useful!

SnS 8)


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 6:30 am 
Quote:
First of all I'd like to know whether the IS is always active if it is switched on even when the exposure time in itself is short enough to guarantee a sharp image. I don't think the manual tells me about this. Will it inactivate itself when the shutter speed gets below a certain value?


It should always be active unless you have super steady hands or a tripod that negates any camera shake.

Quote:
Is it possible that with a short exposure a simultaneous movement of the sensor (which is the type of IS in my camera) can actually prevent maximum sharpness? Not that it will create what the average viewer will call unsharp pictures. On the contrary. The image will look sharp within the expectation of most observers but can it be that without it in certain conditions a photo can actually be sharper than with it?


That doesn't make any sense to me. IS allows you to go shoot at several stops higher than you'd normally be able to accomplish. That means that IS steadies the lense/sensor and allows you to take shots that would otherwise have been blurred due to camera shake.

Now if you are shooting at a setting where you don't need IS, that presumably means that the effect of camera shake is negligible. If that is the case, why would IS cause any problems? The sensor isn't going to shake more than your hands would.

I might have just misunderstood your question ...

Quote:
And will a photo taken with a tripod with IS always be (at least) as sharp as one taken from a tripod without IS or can a photo taken with IS from a tripod in certain situations be less sharp than when taken without IS?


Yes. Why wouldn't it be? If you're mounted on a tripod, you will not need IS so the IS will not kick in even if it's switched on.


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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 10:14 pm 
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You should always switch off any IS when using a tripod as the IS system can actually introduce wobbles of its own when it's looking for something to counteract. Some modern IS systems detect the tipod and automatically switch off, but I'd manually switch it off anyway to be safe.


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PostPosted: Fri Jun 06, 2008 6:49 pm 
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You should always switch off any IS when using a tripod as the IS system can actually introduce wobbles of its own when it's looking for something to counteract.


That doesn't make any sense :? Is this tried and tested, or is this just hearsay?

The reason I'm skeptical is because if there is no vibration why would the IS try to correct for vibrations that aren't there?


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