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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:25 am 
KevinM,

As has already been established, it is not worth changing a 50D for a 60D (as it as not worth changing my 40D for a 50D). That point, I think, is agreed by all.

You echo Gordon's comments that 'you might as well go for the 7D'. Yes, but what if you cannot AFFORD or JUSTIFY (to the 'other half'?) the cost of a 7D?! Also, even if you can justify it, by the time you have saved the extra it may be that the 7D has been discontinued and the 'new, improved' replacement released at full RRP. The cycle then starts again.

People who have been saving up and waiting for the price of the 5D2 to come down will be rather dismayed at the fact there seems to be a serious lack availability. They can now afford it, but cannot find one to buy! BTW - This is what leads me to believe (hope?) that the 5D3 is imminent and Canon have quietly stopped production of the mk2.

Yes, a new model does not need to be an improvement on the old model, particularly if aiming for a lower price point. However, generally a new 'replacement' model IS better, and that is what current xxD owners were expecting. In the case of the 60D it appears Canon has 'moved the goalposts' and targeted the 60D more at the aspirational consumer, making it easier and more attractive as an upgrade from a xxxD body, rather than the serious amateur/semi-pro. The 60D can, therefore, be viewed as 'better' for the xxxD upgrader, but 'worse' for the xxD updater. It is this unannounced shift in target audience that has caused the consternation.

StillFingers,

I would always go for multiple smaller-capacity cards than one or two large cards. These things do (occasionally) fail and it is better to lose some of your shots than all of them.

Nick


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:59 pm 
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Location: The Netherlands
I can only hope that the prices of used 50Ds are going much lower by the release of the 60D...
I could agree with all the statements here, but I understand the big gap between the 50D and the 7D which had to be the 60D.
But hey, the 7D isnt that old! Almost 1 year (?) ago, there wasnt even a 7D, so if you owned a x0D body, you had no choice (yes, moving to the new xxD body).
Canon repaired that gap now, but make another gap too.

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Ruben

Panasonic DMC-FZ18, Panasonic DMC-FZ28, Canon G5, Canon 350D, Canon 50D + BG-E2N
Tamron 17-50 2.8, Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM,
Canon 18-55 II plus lots of Minolta MD/M42 lenses and bodies


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 2:48 pm 
I find the articulated screen just cheapens the whole camera body. It resembles more a consumer level camcorder then a Semi-pro or even entry DSLR. I'd be too worried it would break off, the old screen on the 50d seems more rugged.

The SDXC standard is faster then the CF standard allows so I can understand the logic behind that. But the 5.3 fps continuous drive and the plastic body really pushes it out of the semi-pro and into the mid-range category.

Why is canon nerfing it's semi-pro bodies anyways?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:33 pm 
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No, not nerfing - just splitting the semi-pro line into two different strands of which the 60D and 7D are the first exemplars. This subject has been pretty much thrashed to death already in this thread... :roll:

Bob.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:20 pm 
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We have to leave it as it is.
Could anybody change anything by complaining?
No.

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Ruben

Panasonic DMC-FZ18, Panasonic DMC-FZ28, Canon G5, Canon 350D, Canon 50D + BG-E2N
Tamron 17-50 2.8, Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM,
Canon 18-55 II plus lots of Minolta MD/M42 lenses and bodies


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:36 pm 
@ All - Has anyone had occasion to review and/or use the remote switch/video product "Zigview S2 Live" by Seculine (see link below)?

http://www.zigview.co.uk/seculine-zigvi ... te-lcd.htm

If something like this really works, then my need for an articulating screen is no more...on to the 7D I go (at 8fps it would be a better option than the 60D for surfing/auto racing shots)!

Thanks folks,

Jerry


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:40 pm 
Bob, Ruben,

I agree that this subject has been pretty much done to death, but the amount of activity on this thread does rather indicate the upset/frustration/anger at what Canon has done.

They have effectively moved the xxD range down-market and raised the entry price of the semi-pro club to the cost of the 7D.

No matter how much we may dislike or disagree with this decision, Canon has done it. :(

Oh, well, let's see what Photokina brings...

Nick


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:55 pm 
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If Nikon wasnt that expensive here, and they had a D90 with magnesium body....I went Nikon.

But, I still want to buy a 50D used. It isnt bad. It's still semi pro enough for me.

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Panasonic DMC-FZ18, Panasonic DMC-FZ28, Canon G5, Canon 350D, Canon 50D + BG-E2N
Tamron 17-50 2.8, Canon EF 70-200mm f/4L USM,
Canon 18-55 II plus lots of Minolta MD/M42 lenses and bodies


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:56 pm 
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Just to settle the SD vs CF debate :

I was glad to find that the 500D took SD, as I have a built in SD card reader in the side of my laptop, the cards are much smaller, and saves hooking cables/external readers up.

However, they are not as tough wearing as compact flash. My 4GB SD Card is playing up at the moment, the "lock" switch on the side has become flimsy and keeps moving about freely. The 500D wont read it, yet my smaller point and shoot camera will.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 7:27 pm 
After watching the demo video on youtube... I just realise this camera is pretty sweet. The articulated screen is nice but I wish they put more/nicer features that is actually worth our money.

Cant wait for the review Gordon :D


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:15 pm 
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Hi Nick / SoloRider, you make a very good point and I perfectly understand many existing xxD owners may not be able to afford or justify the current price of the 7D. I understand because there's lot of things I want to buy, but the next step up is too expensive for me right now.

The solution? Wait. Stick with what you've got. Is it really that bad? Presuming it's not fallen apart, the earlier xxD cameras remain excellent and can still take perfectly good pictures. Remember, we don't need to upgrade, and if we can't afford to make the jump we want, we just wait, save more money, watch the prices gradually fall etc. It's not the end of the world!

Are current 50D owners that dissatisifed with their cameras that they desperately need to upgrade right now? I thought - and still think - it's a rather good camera!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:18 pm 
CF is faster, for now, but 60MB/s SDXC cards were announced today, so for most people it's not going to be an issue any more. Sure, there are a handful of 90MB/s CF cards, but are those really needed?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 9:27 pm 
Gordon,

Agreed. There is no point 50D owners changing to anything but the 7D if they can afford it. If they can't then stick with the 50D.

As a 40D owner I was looking for a mid-range camera with some of the whizz-bang features of the 7D. I guess it was not to be. My 40D is a perfectly good camera and I may decide to stick with it rather than move to the 7D. Time will tell.

I disagree with you on the 85mm/50mm portrait debate 'thought! :D

Nick


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:25 pm 
ok SoloRider, and shawndw i'm behind you guys as i now know you feel the same as i do. Thanks

Ruben123 you said that "We have to leave it as it is.
Could anybody change anything by complaining?
No." If you never state how you feel, how would canon ever know how the people feel? By reviews and sites like this one is how. Canon reads and keeps up with the feed back on the new cameras. Apple just showed that with the iphone 4, Steve showed youtube videos in his address to the people.

Ok Moderators i'm now talking to Gordon Laing, and would like to keep it this way. Gordon Laing all i'm trying to say is, if you don't like the 7d which i don't and the 60d is not better then the 50d. What can one do? I've not rant one time here, i'm just the type that goes strait to the point. Maybe some could take it as i'm trolling, but i'm not. The 60d may in deed be a great shooter, but with no dust and moisture countermeasures or magnesium-alloy construction stops this camera way short of semi pro line up. But yet cost all most as much as a 7d why, do you think its ok for canon to do this? I don't and as for you pushing the 7d so hard, i've held the camera and she feels great. But i don't like the way she shoots at all, and to tell you the truth i feel you push that camera way to much.
I'm not looking for "sympathy" i'm a prosumer who wants his money worth. Money hard to come by in todays market and i feel canon found a way to save money, but not trying to pass the saving down to us. . Take a look here http://www.dxomark.com/index.php/en/Camera-Sensor/Sensor-rankings I've always trusted your reviews and liked them, but looking back now i see you favor canon over nikon tell me where the 7d falls under the best sensors of all time.
shoot the d90 does way better, If you like to read how they test the cameras feel free.
I'll remove my self off here as i don't want to bring your forum down as you like to point out. If i can't post freely then i don't need to be here boosting up your sites activity. Thanks and happy shooting to all!


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 12:27 am 
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I am still lumpin along with my trusty 40D..and have just about worn it out, so, I am gonna for reals make the jump to the 7D. Am convinced the 60 doesn't compare...after all the commentary...and I need a little more speed in the fps dept. Can't wait to you guys get your hands on one of em, for reals.

love,
p

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