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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 1:17 pm 
This seems to make sense to me as the best and easiest option.

Is this the best option? To have the subject hold the white balance card and grey card in either hand, as an example, and then use LightRoom or PS CS2 to calibrate the correct white balance etc?

Then take all other pictures without the subject holding any of the cards etc. That way, one knows the test image has been taken from which all other images will simple need a click of LR or PS CS2 to be correctly calibrated.

The human visual system does this automatically. It is always calibrating so we don't see a hint of blue in snow etc. Cameras have been developed to do this but they don’t do it nearly as well and need certain reference points, say clouds to succeed etc.

What do you think?


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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 2:14 pm 
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This technique would work well for a studio setting where the lighting is very controlled from beginning to end, but with outdoor lighting changing so frequently it might be tough.

Setting the white balance with the subject holding the white balance card is a good idea for a few photos at a time, but often the lighting changes from the beginning of the shoot to end.

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PostPosted: Sun Dec 09, 2007 11:45 pm 
Steve, so it is a good idea for indoor shooting. Say during xmas I can do this for each home I visit and then carry out white balance post production using LightRoom and/or PS CS2 - yes?

So what is the answer for outdoors?

I'm going to Florida for my dads 65th birthday (all 16 of us so I want to take really memorable pictures) so it will be quite bright and hot, last week in April and first week in May.

Would you suggest periodically using the example above?

If not, what is the solution. Is it post production all the way.

I will be shooting in RAW.

I’ve just bought quite a few books so I should be up to speed by then. But any helped proffered for be appreciated.


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PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:37 pm 
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Hi G,

Since you're shooting raw your job just got a lot easier. My first choice for outdoor portraits is to shoot in raw and then take care of white balance in post processing. I guess that's the beauty of shooting raw; it's truly the digital equivalent of a film negative. The CR2 file that you end up with is the jumping off point for all your processing.

Don't worry about white balance until you're in the comfort of your own home and have more time. If you want to make things a little easier then yes, you could ask someone in the group to hold an 18% grey card and then take the dropper/white balance tool in photoshop and set the color temperature based on that card. The other problem with this approach is that it takes more time and sometimes you lose the spontaneity of the moment.

-steve

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 5:07 am 
So the grey card is more important than the white card - yes

I got these two.

• MacBeth White Balance Chart

• MacBeth Grey Scale Chart

http://tinyurl.com/2app78


So with the grey scale card do I just let them hold that for the first shot too and then use that as a reference in LR or PS CS2, the same as with the white balance card?

You say don't worry about the white card, why not? Can LR and PS CS2 do this for me proper? How can they know the correct balance fore sure. I'm reading one of the best LR books right now but I'm still in the intro section ;-)

I did know that in RAW all while balance settings are ignored - is this true?

Can I not just use the grey scale card as it has white balance too? What do you think?

Thanks for the advice. I’m learning.

I got my Canon Angle Finder C yesterday. That's a cool device.


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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 10:46 am 
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Hi G,

Here's a site that can explain all of this MUCH better than I ever could. :?

There's even an example of putting the grey card in the scene to correct color.

http://www.digitalartsphotography.com/instructions.htm

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2007 3:10 pm 
Thanks Steve.

Yeah I've read that one and a lot of others too. Still more to read though. Then I'm on to aperture, and f-numbers etc.

Can I ask you another question? I don't have a grey card; it is a white, grey and black striped one. Will that be ok? I think it will for post production. They are both A4 size.

Thanks very much for answering my questions relating to this thread. I’ve learnt a lot already.

Incidentally, is it the case that the grey card is more important for white balancing than a white balancing card? I’ve read that it is.

Ta


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 12:43 pm 
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Hey G,

Sorry it took a while to get around to answering this one.

*btw - is there a way to track your own posts on the forum? I like to check up on my posts, but sometimes forget exactly where they all are.*

Back to the topic at hand. Your grey/white/black card should be perfect. I think CS3 has a eye dropper tool that allows you to set the grey/white/black points individually to get an even more accurate color balance.

To answer your last question, I'm not sure what color card is best, but I'm guessing the multi-colored card you have is perfect since it has all three. I'd definitely go out and do a couple practice shoots with your card before the big day comes.

-steve

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 12:49 pm 
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seattlesteve wrote:
...*btw - is there a way to track your own posts on the forum? I like to check up on my posts, but sometimes forget exactly where they all are.*...

You can always check the "Notify me when a reply is posted" checkbox just above the "Preview" button when you compose your posts.

Bob.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 1:08 pm 
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Noted! Thanks Bob. :D

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2007 10:53 pm 
I'II get back to you later Steve.

I was goning to tell Steve the same but I have this setting enabled and I don't get reply notifications. I have to search under G every time.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 9:33 am 
Thanks Steve for continually replying on this subject. It's an important one to get sorted.

Does CS2 have the dropper too? I cannot afford the upgrade to CS3 and frankly, although I have PS CS2 I don't really understand it. I have the Wiley 1100 page book but don't have the time to read it (started it but I will have to re-start reading it as it’s been some time now) at the moment as I'm spending all my time studying and writing content for a backup company and my own website. That alone stucks all my time away. Trying to make a living as an IT engineer too means I don’t have much time.

I have LR and I have an excellent book to read, but it will take time getting through it. I think I will get expert in LR, and then slowly more over to PS CS2 and use the two together.

Well I have both cards so I can use both I guess or just the triple as I can get the white balance reading form the white stripe.

I’m reading a lot about white balance and grey cards, F-numbers, aperture, exposure. You get the idea. But it all comes down to vision and composition in the end. But one still needs to now what the technical stuff is for regardless.

But times running out for the time being. Got a uni assignment that needs to be in and some sort science course for my other degree too.

Sure, I’II be ready by April.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 3:10 pm 
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I'm using LR and CS2 also. I can't justify the upgrade to CS3 yet, besides most of my workflow goes through LR now anyway. It's cut my time processing jobs in half. If there are some serious flaws in a photo or I feel like getting a little more creative (like creating the mini scenes) then I'll use CS2, otherwise it's LR all the way now.

To answer your question, yes CS2 has a the eye dropper tool to set the black point, grey point and white point. The next time you load a photo press ctrl+L to bring up the level window and in the bottom right you'll see those tools.

Have fun writing your papers.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2007 6:22 pm 
Thanks for that Steve. The guy from PC World, that Gordon writes for too, who deal with photography and video, said that PS CS3 was a big upgrade from PS CS2 but like you it is to rich for me and I hate activation.

Like you, I’m going to take the best shots I can, then use LR and tweak with PS CS2.

I went on your site to see your photos. I look at other photographers composition as it helps me.

Tell me Steve, is this this pict of The Luxemburg Gardens or Louie the 14th house. I cannot spell it but you will know ; -) It begin with V - I have severe dyslexia.

http://tinyurl.com/2y4d9g

We stayed for 6 night and 7 days 10 mins walk from Montmartre Cemetery,

I was looking at all your Paris photos. I have fun working out where somewhere is on the minimal of information.

I think I know quite a few of them as I went to Paris with my fiancée, so it was nice looking at your photos.

Not looking forward to doing the paper. Still getting over the 30+ hour mate and neighbors freebie jobs. It’s got to be in by Wednesday, so I will crack on with it on Saturday.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 15, 2007 1:48 am 
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G wrote:
Tell me Steve, is this this pict of The Luxemburg Gardens or Louie the 14th house.

http://tinyurl.com/2y4d9g



You got it with your first guess. Jardin du Luxembourg is my absolute favorite spot to sit and do nothing. An occasional photo now and then, but that's about all I like to do there, just sit and watch life go by.

btw - What's that "tinyurl" thing? How did you get that long link down to such a 'tiny' link?

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