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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 1:09 am 
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Shot a gig tonight (Well its 2am, so "last night") for a band call The Manifestos.

www.myspace.com/themanifestos - if you want to give them a quick listen,not got there songs properly recorded yet as you might be able to tell by sound quality.


Anyway, one of my mates (niki) is in the band so thats how I landed it.

Didn't get paid but I'm not to fussed, let me shoot a real live music act and find the pitfalls before I charge anyone.


First pitfall - You can NEVER have a fast enough lens!!! I was shooting at ISO1600 or 3200 @ f/2.8 the whole time, sometimes my shutter speeds as low as 1/20th!!!

Crazy!

So the 28mm f/1.8 or 30mm f/1.4 along with 50mm f/1.4 will have to be bought very soon.




http://www.flickr.com/photos/danieldevi ... 694315064/



Here are a few - but please also comment on flickr and look at the whole set.


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CHECK OUT THE REST @ http://www.flickr.com/photos/danieldevi ... 694315064/

_________________
Canon EOS 5DmkII + BG-E6 + Canon EOS 40D + BG-E2N + Canon EOS 33
Canon 17-40 F/4L USM + Canon 24-70 F/2.8L USM + Canon 28mm F/1.8 USM + Canon 70-200 F/2.8L USM IS + Canon 85mm F/1.8 USM
Canon Speedlite 580EX II + Canon Speedlite 540EZ + 2 x Nikon SB-80DX
Cactus V2s Wireless Trigger - 5 x Cactus V2s Wireless Reciever

MY FLICKR!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:25 am 
I did a more traditional style of gig recently, (see a few shots ive uploaded to my flickr). As far as faster lens, I had my 35mm F2 and I was shooting at 1/60th at Iso 400, and 1/100th at Iso 800. Obviously different lighting but hey. Also, when it comes to doing gigs, timing is absolutely crucial, in one of the shots you've got one of the band members holding their hands in the air, Ideally you would have clicked the shutter the second the hands were put together. The only downside is that you have to hold the camera to your eye for say ten seconds, and look stupid in the process to get those shots without motion blur.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 11:31 am 
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Motion Blur gives the sense of motion ;)

But na camera just didn't focus fast enough for the shot.

40D even with a f/2.8 lens still can't quite get there fast enough.

_________________
Canon EOS 5DmkII + BG-E6 + Canon EOS 40D + BG-E2N + Canon EOS 33
Canon 17-40 F/4L USM + Canon 24-70 F/2.8L USM + Canon 28mm F/1.8 USM + Canon 70-200 F/2.8L USM IS + Canon 85mm F/1.8 USM
Canon Speedlite 580EX II + Canon Speedlite 540EZ + 2 x Nikon SB-80DX
Cactus V2s Wireless Trigger - 5 x Cactus V2s Wireless Reciever

MY FLICKR!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 12:19 pm 
Thanks for sharing your images and experience. I find a lack of control in lighting and composition variation from your images. All of them are taken from between hip and eye level without much regard for direction of light. The best example would be the 1st image. The lighting is strongest at the hand over the mic rather than over the face. Dare I even say this, but it's not always about equipment - and you've got some pretty top-class gear already. It certainly can lend a helping hand in low-light but an accomplished photographer will find the best way to work with the uncontrollable available light whatever kit they're carrying.

It's not always about sharpness. If AF wasn't fast enough, then there's MF with pre-focusing and waiting for the opportune moment. There's always scope in such events to play around with motion blur to bring out the action. Being a PJ you need to capture the essence of the event and a story.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 2:31 pm 
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Couldn't move really, so couldn't do much with composition either, hopefully their next gig should give me a bit more space.

Manual focusing would have been a good idea actually.

Lack of control in lighing, and direction of light - nothing I could do sorry =(

We are setting up wireless flashes for their next gig =) Didn't have time because I just got home from work and only just made it on time.

I take the points though, i'll try and ask them to ramp up the lighting a bit more so i can get lower ISO's even if its just 800/1600 and try and make sure I don't get the light spots on different bits.

I know about the rear curtain sync stuff, but the flash looked horrible inside, really tight room and bouncing off the green roof or wooden walls didn't work well either, CTO gel may have helped on the green roof.

_________________
Canon EOS 5DmkII + BG-E6 + Canon EOS 40D + BG-E2N + Canon EOS 33
Canon 17-40 F/4L USM + Canon 24-70 F/2.8L USM + Canon 28mm F/1.8 USM + Canon 70-200 F/2.8L USM IS + Canon 85mm F/1.8 USM
Canon Speedlite 580EX II + Canon Speedlite 540EZ + 2 x Nikon SB-80DX
Cactus V2s Wireless Trigger - 5 x Cactus V2s Wireless Reciever

MY FLICKR!


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 6:25 pm 
DD_nVidia wrote:
Couldn't move really, so couldn't do much with composition either, hopefully their next gig should give me a bit more space.

Lack of control in lighing, and direction of light - nothing I could do sorry =(

We are setting up wireless flashes for their next gig =) Didn't have time because I just got home from work and only just made it on time.

I know about the rear curtain sync stuff, but the flash looked horrible inside, really tight room and bouncing off the green roof or wooden walls didn't work well either, CTO gel may have helped on the green roof.


You don't have to apologise!

How about the KISS principle? Keeping it simple. The best way to get around the lighting issue is to be prepared. Get there early (doesn't appear that you did) and scout around with the lighting. Once you know where best to work with the available light, then keep those in mind during the event. Moving around during an event is also quite important if you want to increase your odds of capturing a story. As for wireless flashes, that might help to an extent, but using available light and having a better eye for when to take images or how to set them up would yield stronger results. Even if your current images were well lit, I think they would struggle in any editorial. They don't convey enough about the event.

Of course it's just my experience and opinion here. Equipment is nothing without the knowledge behind it.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:25 pm 
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I agree with your ideas PhotoJ - but you don't quite get it lol

I couldn't get there a second earlier, I had just finished work in edinburgh (well livingston) had to travel 24 miles back to my house, then 8 miles back into dunfermline, AND get dinner before I went back out - Don't think I've ate mince and totties so quick in my life!!!


I couldn't move more than a few inches until the end.

It was PACKED.


But, as for the images not convaying the event; well I've never done this before so I wasn't expecting anything in that department, they just wanted the pictures to look good, so thats all I was trying to get.

I agree equipment is nothing without the knowledge; but what the equipment does make sure of is that it isn't the thing holding me back, so all the blame is on me if I don't get the photos right.

Only a bad photographer blames his tools - mine served me well and I did the best with what I had.

I just got in the door to the place and by the time i got to the front of the crowd they started playing - JUST IN TIME. I had no chance to scout good angles, or even move about since it was packed right up to the stage, couldn't get any closer really.

The venue PJ's isn't really very spacious upstairs, had they been playing downstairs it might have been a different story.


Basically what i'd like is some examples of other photos shot in a place just as tight. I was less than 50cm away from the drummer, and less than 1.5-2m away from the lead singer. thats how tight it is.

_________________
Canon EOS 5DmkII + BG-E6 + Canon EOS 40D + BG-E2N + Canon EOS 33
Canon 17-40 F/4L USM + Canon 24-70 F/2.8L USM + Canon 28mm F/1.8 USM + Canon 70-200 F/2.8L USM IS + Canon 85mm F/1.8 USM
Canon Speedlite 580EX II + Canon Speedlite 540EZ + 2 x Nikon SB-80DX
Cactus V2s Wireless Trigger - 5 x Cactus V2s Wireless Reciever

MY FLICKR!


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 4:53 am 
Really good reply Photoj. That was a real honest and to the point reply. Good constructive criticism is what I like to hear when I ask for input on here. Go find a few of my posts! LOL I would love to hear your opinion.

DD, one thing I have to say about the first photo... It looks like he is kind of picking his nose. lol Im not trying to be funny, but when I first saw the top photo, I thought it was one of those joking pics when people stick their finger in their nose. LOL

I started out photographing bands years ago and was pretty successful at it. I was the photographer to go to for gigs and band photos. Not trying to talk myself up here but I do know a thing or two about this area.
Take it for what it's worth....

You mentioned setting up flashes. In my experience, not a good idea (unless you have a crew). I have photographed bands in places from huge arenas to almost dives (small trashy bars) and I can tell you that in EVERY single place, there will be at least one person that will try to mess with your equipment, whether it be the drunk person being loud or someone just doing it to screw around. Something is going to get knocked over or stolen. You need a crew with you, watching over flashes and other gear that is set up.

I can't stress that enough. Having a crew. At least 2-3 people helping you.
Another thing, I would never ask the lighting tech to "ramp up the lighting" just so you can lower your ISO to get better shots. They are picky about running the lights just like we are about our camera settings. I am also a musician and it gets HOT under those lights, especially in small venues.
I dont know if the band brings their own lights or if the venue has lights set up already with a tech. Even if the lights are the bands lights, it's going to be hard to accomplish any sort of lighting that will remain consistent because it's stage lights.

From the shots that you have shown on here, there looks to be ample light to work with. The high ISO doesnt look like it interfered with anything in my opinion. The isnt much noise in the images.

Focusing seemed to be one of your biggest short fall and like Photoj said, "composition". I know you said that this was a first for you and it's not like you did a bad job.

My final thoughts, because this is getting long.
You said that you know the band, right? If they want good shots of themselves, then tell them that you are going to be onstage shooting them. Get up in the action as much as you can, without being in the way. The band can tell the crowd that they have a photographer there and that you are going to be around doing your job. Every band I worked with would let the crowd know and also let them know that they too would be in the photographs, which would also pump up the crowd.
The band knows you are there to make them look good, so they should be very accommodating to your needs and you to theirs.
I would suggest using mainly primes for a gig like the one you shot.
Flashes take So much away from the feel of a show like this and like you said "motion is good" (to an extent)
I dont know how long this band played. Depending on the band, their sets usually last anywhere from 30 mins to 4 hours. Depends on if they are the opening act or the main act and also how well they are known.
Find out how long before hand. Also get shots of them packing up their gear and also setting up.

Sorry this got so long, but it's finally something I can really contribute to. I wish it wasnt so late though because my brain is a bit fried right now, so I hope that I am making sense.

I have to say it once more.. WATCH YOUR GEAR! :) I know that you will.

Oh and the last photo....Looks like it shouldnt even be in the same set. It almost looks like a paparazzi shot. :D Good first try.
I hope I was somewhat helpful. If not PM me and let me know. lol


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:04 am 
lol, 'picking his nose'..

I'm interested to hear how long the gig was also.

I've got to aggree with mstone as well, Prime's really make all the difference. I was just thinking, a 35mm as well as a 50mm would be a good bet, maybe having a second/second hand dslr to save swapping lenses as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 9:26 am 
Gregory.Rotter wrote:
lol, 'picking his nose'..

I'm interested to hear how long the gig was also.

I've got to aggree with mstone as well, Prime's really make all the difference. I was just thinking, a 35mm as well as a 50mm would be a good bet, maybe having a second/second hand dslr to save swapping lenses as well.


lol am I wrong about the nose picking?
Actually I would use either a 17mm or a 24mm. Having a second hand dslr would be a great idea as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:24 am 
Lol, no you're pretty close to the mark on that one, if you use your imagination of course 8) If you look at my last photo on my flickr, there's a shot of a woman smoking a ciggarete, while something else happens to be next to her face..which in turn etc, but that's just me using my imagination here lol.

Hmm, I'm not familiar with the Canon line-up, but the any primes below the 35mm F2 D, are F2.8. ;

http://imaging.nikon.com/products/imagi ... /index.htm

Canon offers a 24mm F 1.4 prime, but wider than that and you might as well get a zoom with constant F2.8, which i take it he's already got??

Ultimately, I were doing Gig's and was getting any money from my shooting, I'd go for a D300, and a 35mm F2D, or 24-70F2,8.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 6:30 am 
Gregory.Rotter wrote:

Hmm, I'm not familiar with the Canon line-up, but the any primes below the 35mm F2 D, are F2.8. ;

http://imaging.nikon.com/products/imagi ... /index.htm

Canon offers a 24mm F 1.4 prime, but wider than that and you might as well get a zoom with constant F2.8, which i take it he's already got??

Ultimately, I were doing Gig's and was getting any money from my shooting, I'd go for a D300, and a 35mm F2D, or 24-70F2,8.


The Canon 24mm 1.4L is a gem. I bought it a couple of months ago and havent taken it off my camera since.


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 15, 2008 8:14 pm 
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Wish I could afford a 24mm f/1.4L

Looks like I'll have to make do with the 28mm f/1.8 haha

Thanks for the comments everyone, I'll try and put some of advice into practice for my next gig on the 30th.

_________________
Canon EOS 5DmkII + BG-E6 + Canon EOS 40D + BG-E2N + Canon EOS 33
Canon 17-40 F/4L USM + Canon 24-70 F/2.8L USM + Canon 28mm F/1.8 USM + Canon 70-200 F/2.8L USM IS + Canon 85mm F/1.8 USM
Canon Speedlite 580EX II + Canon Speedlite 540EZ + 2 x Nikon SB-80DX
Cactus V2s Wireless Trigger - 5 x Cactus V2s Wireless Reciever

MY FLICKR!


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