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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 7:26 am 
Hi Dave,
one question for you.
Since I live in Croatia we get most of new stuff with delay, 
Fortunately my cousin is coming from Perth at beginning of May.
Of course, I already send email to him to get me one HS10.
Could you tell me few stores there …. just in case he need some help.
thanks


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 8:33 am 
Dkacunic - Perth is 3,276km from Sydney, where I am - that's about 800km further than the 2,498km from London to Moscow, so I don't know the Perth area at all. But I do know that Perth is about the most expensive city in Australia to buy Cameras.

Australia is a very expensive place to buy cameras (or lenses) overall. (Last year, in US-dollars, my Canon SX10 IS cost 50% more here, than in the US.)

Also, Cameras only have 12-months Warranty here, and extensions to 2 or 3 years are expensive. If your Cousin is travelling via the US or UK, he would be able to get a Camera at a lower price in either area, and likely a lot more Warranty included in the price.

As far as the HS10 goes - while there's only one Review out on it so far, and there are some User reports - (Amazon, if I may mention that here) - in which some of the early buyers aren't too happy with it. Several have returned it for a refund.

I don't know if that's because they expected it to be "magic" - and just used Auto and Program, or didn't use the other modes - Aperture and Shutter Priority, and Manual - or didn't try it on a tripod to "cure the blur" at 30x....

The HS10 needs more Reviews before I'd buy it. That is - if the IQ is "pretty good" when the proper modes are used, fine...

Putting a Canon SX10 in Auto and waving it around for "Snaps" at 20x would make it look like a "dreadful" camera, too - which it certainly isn't!

However, if your Cousin is leaving in a couple of weeks, and you want him to buy something here - perhaps you'd be wiser to get a camera which has been Reviewed and checked-out better than the HS10 yet has.

The Nikon P100 - which uses the same sensor as the HS10 - is apparently not a "good IQ" device - and here in Australia has dropped in price from over $700.00 on release a few weeks back, to $539.00 now.

Perhaps somebody here has some better ideas - but rushing out to be an "early purchaser" of a pretty expensive P&S/Bridge camera that hasn't been well Reviewed yet, but does have some "very disappointed" User reports, seems not to be a good idea.

Dave.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 11:05 am 
Dave,
Thanks for reply.
I know that perth is on the other side of the country, but I didn't expect price difference?!
My friend from US got one and he told me that IQ is more than decent (for him)
As I’m pretty inexperienced (thus not expecting wonders) in this field I believe this camera would be OK for me. if you give me Canon 5d I would probably got same or worse results :( so I can practice with this one :)
I really need it for family events and soon for kids :) some of the images will probably end up printed on classic size photos so I really do not care for 100% crops from a 10 MP image.
..And some short 720p videos…
I know that you are right about waiting for more reviews and that is wiser to buy P100 or SX1 but I had some great times with Fuji cam – call it brand loyalty. (but I must say I was pretty lucky with this kind of impulse-acquisitions --- I have I hunch this is good camera with bad firmware and lot of users who did not bother to read the manual.
Some of images I saw on different forums are really good.
My opinion is that people expected, like you said, magic, thanks to Fuji marketing.
Price in Australia is 600 AUD (i saw few online stores), which is still much cheaper than here. can you confirm this price. Can you find HS10 in stores, or just on-line?
It would be great If you could suggest some other camera with min.10x manual zoom with 720p video.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 12:34 pm 
Dkacunic - I certainly didn't suggest buying the Nikon P100... The price has already fallen below that of the older design Canon SX20 IS, here. The Reviews on the P100 are not good at all...

The HS10 here in Sydney has dropped over $200.00 from its pre-release "projected" price to $559.00 shop-price - cheaper than the Canon SX20 IS - which is 20x zoom and doesn't do 1920 x 1080 Video.

If you want to consider Cameras other than the HS10 - Gordon has done Reviews here on the Canons, SX20 IS, and SX10 IS. His are the most detailed and accurate of any Reviews I've ever seen - and he's not afraid to show any "bad points" in any camera, either.

The SX20 has the things you describe - over 10x zoom - it's 20x, does Std HD (the 1280 x 720 level) Video - and 640 x 480, of course. That's $589.00, here. (US$542.00)

The Canon SX1 has Full (1920 x 1980) HD Video, otherwise is similar to the SX20. If you want that level of Video - the SX1's 1920 x 1080 is in the MOV container, and needs a quite powerful PC and good software to edit/process.

The Canon SX1 IS costs $754.00 here. (US$694.00)

The 1280 x 720 Video in the SX20 is also in the MOV container, but is easier to handle. It's quite good quality, from the samples I've seen.

Gordon has also done excellent Reviews on the Panasonic Lumix Bridge Cameras. If you prefer a similar shape to the Canons, but rather lighter weight, very good IQ, and 1280 x 720 Video - have a look at those.

Also have a look at the SX20 sample images and threads on Forums... From what you've been saying, over 10x and 720 Video, so on, it will do what you need - and you'd be buying a model that's a "known quanity" - which the HS10 is not.

Like the SX10 - the SX20 can "stretch" a bit past its 20x optical zoom with its built-in Teleconverter (it's a processor function, not just "digital zoom") - to get a viewable image, if you can't get closer or do it another way, but don't plan on doing printouts....

Dave.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 6:58 pm 
I'm looking for the 'perfect' camera for quite some time, I kinda look at the speedy SX1 and the reliable FZ35/38 ... now HS10 came, but... images seem softer at wide end, but in overall, images, from what i've seen, are soft no matter what focal distance you use.... however, for most of people is more than enough, since, if you reduce them from 10MP to 6MP or so, noise, sharpness and color look pretty awesome...

I'll wait for more review before decide what camera to buy, my mobile phone has more than 5000 photos taken - i sigh a lot when try to shot with 'low' light or dark subjects, however macros and panoramic shots (12MP images with a 3MP sensor - fun, fun) look awesome most of the times...

If we could replace film with a digital sensor... that would be awesome... i have an old Nikon F401x working like new ;)

If everything fails i'll be keeping money for the next years (i hope that it doesn't come into decades... ) and buy a Panasonic GH1 or something...


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 1:32 am 
Hi dkacunic,
If you aren't a pixel peeper and don't take prints at full size, you would most likely be happy with the HS10. If you go through the Amazon reviews, there are people who are very happy with it. I guess being fair, we expected this tiny sensor camera to match a dslr head-on with its 30x and other fancy features. While the iq, maybe, fails to truly compare to dslrs, I believe the margin is not that wide that it will be obvious when viewing on a tv or small prints, especially if family is your purpose. Maybe, on the contrary you will actually enjoy the fancy features!
If you can wait for more reviews, nothing like it, but I'd say this looks like a better bet than P100 and older design cameras, particularly now that the price is down to a more reasonable one.
This is just my opinion, please don't go blindly by it. You are the best judge yourself!
Jinay.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 9:04 am 
Like I wrote before – family photos and short clips.
We are expecting child in November, so I would definitely use it for movies, until proper camera arrives (but I'm still counting that maybe HS10 could replace cheaper, dedicated HD video cameras).
Since I manage to grasp small portion of what manual controlled camera can do with my previous finepix(unfortunately my brother broke it) I will probably explore this side of HS10 as well. If by any chance I discover talent  for photography I would probably buy some entry or mid-level dSLR and have all the fun with it.
For now HS10 will be interesting toy and for that matter I can’t say that all the gimmicks and “marketing lines” aren’t interesting to me 
Now I just hope that this volcanic-dust cloud go away so my cousin can actually fly to Europe (with my new HS10 )


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:25 am 
Hi,
congratulations for November! And, please get us some ups and downs on the camera after you test....
Jinay.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 8:58 am 
Thanks Jinay
Airports opened today so it should be here at beginning of May. 
Of course, I will keep you posted.
Just hope they will have it on stock in Australia.
:?


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 7:50 am 
Hi,

Just found a picture-only review, but it is very useful.

http://www.pbase.com/middlehill/fujifil ... s10_review

Shows all practical applications of software features and real-life tests on noise, DOF, shutter, pro-lowlight etc.

I hope I am not being biased with or against this camera, but looks pretty decent. Though, realistically it can't compare DSLRs in noise and DoF. It seems to be doing a good job nonetheless!

Jinay.

P.S.: I hope it's okay to post the link here.....


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 Post subject: fuji hs 10
PostPosted: Sat Apr 24, 2010 10:10 am 
Well guys the dye is cast, I have decided against the HS 10 and gone a bit mad and bought the Canon EOS 500D with EF-S 18-55mm & EF-S 55-250mm lenses. With already having the Canon SX 10 I thought it would be a bit crazy to buy a similar Bridge camera albeit a slightly longer lens.

So I am delving into the world of DSLR cameras it wasn't cheap $1330 Aussie & $1222 US & £800 Stirling but as I am 60 yrs old I probably wont be buying a lot more cameras in my lifetime so I thought I would push the boat out.

If any of you decide to buy the HS 10 I will be most interested to see if you think I have missed anything.

Cheers
_________________
Donny
Quote:





Just thought I'd let you guys know the Cannon 500D is superb and I'm having some great fun with it. Some of the portraits are awesome with the shallow depth of field its something I have not been able to do before with the SX 10.
I'll be looking out on here to see if any of you guys buy the HS10 and what you think. All best wishes and happy snapping.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 1:46 pm 
Hi Zakdog,

This post better beongs in the Canon section, but a quick question anyways...
I believe the 55-250mm Canon lens does not have USM. How is it in practice? Is the absence of USM a deal-breaker or it hardly matters? I have a friend who is in dilema for purchasing this lens.

Thanks in advance,
Jinay.


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 Post subject: FUJI HS 10
PostPosted: Sun Apr 25, 2010 4:07 pm 
Hi Jinay
The 55-250mm lens is image stabilized but does not have USM. To be honest I have never used a USM lens so I don't know the difference but the pictures I have taken with it are miles better than the SX10 which in its self is a cracking little camera in my opinion I am just enjoying being able to do things that P&S cameras don't allow you to do.

Cheers Don


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 3:14 am 
Hi,

Got some HS10 images and reviews. From broken bits of data scattered over various user reviews and sample images, there seem to be the main points:

1. It is a good camera, whether it stands up to the tall claims or not!

2. White balance adjustment is excellent.

3. It can take some time to lock focus, particularly in dark conditions. But, some users call it snappy too.

4. Metering seems good, but sometimes inconsistent.

5. It has got one of the BEST lenses around. It handles pincushion and barrel distortion and chromatic abressions extremely well. However, it seems better at the farther end of the zoom.

6. Video is decent. Though, it can sometimes be jerky.

7. RAW is slow, which is expected of a non-dslr. However, people complain even jpegs take a long time to write. But, there is no mention if this was before or after the firmware update.

8. Motion remover is good. It works best when objects are moving perpendicular to the camera. In case of parallel objects, there may be ghosts. However, it is very usable even without a tripod.

9. Pro low-light mode seems to work nicely, considerably brightening the scene without blowing out highlights.

10. Macro and super-macro mode looks better than most competitors but it is unfair to compare it to a dslr, since it just does not have that shallow a dof.

11. Noise is one big 'controversy!' Some people are happy with the way it tackles noise and some are very unhappy. Overall, it does seem it handles noise very effectively. Most people from the 'unhappy' group have upgraded from previous Fuji models. It seems that the S200EXR simply was better in noise terms. I downloaded a couple of sample pics taken at iso400 and iso800 in full resolution. On my full screen, which is 15" the pics looked very good. But only when you go to the full size you come to know all the goof-ups! Very find details are lost and there are artefacts due to noise/noise reduction. This one seems to take a pretty heavy handed approach to noise reduction, prefering to lose fine details to noise. However, if you are interested in viewing the pics on a tv or taking prints, you should not have much problem. I don't know about the full size prints, but anywhere smaller than that it should be fine. Again, it seems that way. I am not giving any guarantee!

12. As for the motion panorama, I am not very sure. It does give ghosts if something is the scene moves. But it also seems to have a fixed maximum resolution on the horizontal or vertical axis. So, under certain conditions the 'traditional' system of stitching photos may give you more resolution.

Please give your inputs....

Jinay.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:29 am 
Jinay - According to some Forum-Talk and Reviews, the 1.01 Firmware update does a few fixes - including the situation where JPEGs saved with RAWs looked sharper than JPEGs saved alone.

The HS10 in IS mode seems to have the same habits as the S2000HD (which I have.) With the S2000 in Continous mode IS, while it removes the obvious shake, it causes a fine blurring - on edges on the diagonal in particular. Using IS as Shoot-only improves this. But turning it off and using a rest, beanbag, folded jacket, etc, is best. Or use a tripod, of course.

With the S2000HD, that slight difference between IS Shoot-only and No-IS when hand-held seems to go with slower shutter speeds. Above 1/200 it's not apparent.

So that "might" be something to look at with the HS10.

Some Fuji Zooms with Dual-IS, with the ISO at Auto - will use both sensor IS and will raise the ISO to get a higher shutter speed when further out in the zoom-range. That affects colour and to some extent focus. While I don't yet know this, that might have been the reason for the "poor colour and focus" further out in the zoom range that caused some "User Reviewers" to return their HS10s.

At the max 15x zoom with the S2000, you can be at ISO 400 or 800 in bright daylight. Manually set the ISO at 100 or 200, and use IS at Shoot-only.

To speed responses up quite noticeably with the S2000 you can turn on High-Speed Shooting mode. This gives a faster "half-down and focus - then shoot" function. It uses a little more battery, but it's very functional.

On my S2000 I've put that into Shutter Priority and saved that to Custom setting on the modes dial. With the HS10 you could do that with Aperture Priority (which the S2000 doesn't have) - and have the "faster" mode a couple of clicks away fron the standard Aperture Priority mode.

The HS10 does have the High-Speed function - Page 91 in the Manual.

After looking at "complaints" about the HS10's HD Video - those doing so seemed to be doing the 1920 x 1080 at mid to long zoom handheld... Which is a pretty big "ask" even for a cheaper $500.00 Camcorder.

Those using the 1280 x 720 mode seem to be highly pleased with it.

With the older S2000HD, the 640 x 480 Video, handheld, is quite adequate, but the 1280 x 720 is very much more manageable over a soft support - or of course, a tripod.

In the S2000, that Std HD is compliant MPEG4, saved directly as MP4 files. Done carefully it's good quality, though using the zoom while shooting puts a heavy clatter into the audio.

The HS10, now using the modern H264/MOV format, should be rather better. Hopefully the twist-zoom will settle down into a smooth video-zoom, as some are claiming that with their obviously still new cameras that it's a bit jerky.

I'm starting to think that the HS10 will do its best still images out past 20x in the zoom range, with the IS off (or Shoot-only) in Aperture Priority or Manual, using a soft rest or tripod. From the samples now available, it's certainly capable of producing good results for the sensor size.

The folk complaining about "overdone" noise reduction of the HS10's JPEGs don't seem to have tried the RAWs - which shouldn't have any of that done to them.

Dave.


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