Camera Labs

Didn't want to drag the M9 thread off-topic so I thought I'd post it here.

I am still looking to maybe switch to Leica and yesterday went to the local store to see what would be possible. Thought I would ask what I could get back for the 7D. Well, that was only about half of what I paid, so the 7D is staying.

Still thinking about the different options, an M6 or M8. I really like the idea of getting an M8 in order to keep the digital workflow, but it is a lot of money. Even if I save money by getting a Voigtlander or Zeiss lens for it. I guess this is going to be a long term project.

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Canon 7D | EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS

Hi Dutch,

I wouldn't expect the store to give you a good part exchange on the 7D. But if the camera's in really good condition and you still have the original packaging you might be surprised what you can get for it. I sold my EOS 40D some time ago now via Amazon UK and got what the camera was worth rather than what some store was prepared to offer so they could make a large profit.

If Amazon isn't an option for you in the Netherlands make sure whoever you use has the means to secure payment before you ship, follow their terms and conditions to the letter and never ship to another country where you'll have no legal recourse. Such security is bought at the price of a percentage by the agent but there are organised criminals out there who will try and rob you. The first two offers I had for my 40D sounded absolutely reasonable but both involved shipping outside the UK. Not a chance!

Bob.

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OM-D E-M5 + ED 12-50mm, H-PS14042E, H-F007014E, L-RS014150E, M.ZUIKO DIGITAL 45mm 1:1.8.
Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.

Hi Bob,

Yes, selling online can give a much better return, but to be honest I don't really want to go through all that trouble. Especially because there are indeed people who will try and rob you. I might ask an uncle of mine who deals with cameras on ebay, but I've been reading up and other options might be interesting as well.

Both the M6 and M8 are pretty expensive. Even the M6 will go for around €1300 out here. I kinda prefered the M6 because it looks so much better than the M5 and has the metering the M3 is missing. But I've been reading up and found that Voigtlander makes a really nice meter for use on an M3. The VC II actually looks pretty good on an M3, unlike those huge meters. That opens up the option of keeping the 7D, buying a Leica rangefinder and still not spending too much so I can start saving up for an M8 or even an M9.

It's just something I'll consider. I like taking my time because even an M3 will cost a reasonable amount of money at the end of the day.

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Canon 7D | EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS

After last Wednesday I thought I'd post in this thread again. I had held a Leica M8 before, which was great, but I couldn't turn it on back then (no battery) nor could I try focusing (no lens). On my trip to London though, I planned a walking route that took me and my family past the Leica Store in Mayfair, so I could get some more time with an M. And I did.

I shot a couple of pictures with the 50mm Summilux on the silver M9. First shot was completely out of focus, but not because the focus method was new to me. As fellow Leica/rangefinder fans will know, you focus the lens by lining up the image in a little rectangle with the image of the entire frame. I knew that. Just lined up the right eyepiece of these binoculars with the left eyepiece for the shot below:



One thing I had to get used to is the lack of IS. I took some shots of M lenses and the X1 below (which doubles as a selfportrait!) and they were all motion-blurred from my excited hands. The shot below was taken at 1/8th. Might work if you own a Leica (and you're not as excited to get to use it), but it didn't work now. Didn't want to dig into the menus and change ISO...



The build on the M9 is really just fantastic, better even than expected. Same goes for the lens. I got my A700 out of my bag just outside the store, and it felt like a piece of plastic. Still, that wouldn't be a reason for me to go Leica, build alone.
I really liked the silent shutter though. A very gentle, wonderful click. Great for the photography I like to do. Also, it seemed just as usable for a left-eyed photographer like myself as for a right-eyed.
What I didn't like? The screen is low res, I'm used to 3" 921k. The buttons on the back were a little small. But that really is pretty much it.

So, the question is: To Leica, or not to Leica? After Wednesday, I definitely want to get a Leica M9, but I'll have to think of a bearable way to save up that much money. I'd be fine shooting with just a 50mm for a while, but as said, with a Summilux, I'll need 8000 euros.

One last shot then:



- Bjorn -

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Street and documentary photographer | Google+ | Twitter | Blog | Tumblr

Leica M9-P (my article on Camera Labs) | Leica D-Lux 5 | 50mm Summilux

Hi Bjorn,

Thanks for sharing! (I haven't been on here in a while (months) so I only saw the post just now.) Must have been a great experience shooting such a fine combination. The last shot looks great!

I am still considering the options myself. The M9 tops the list, but is way too expensive. I just got married and bought a house so saving has become more difficult. Especially since some (very expensive) stuff around the house needed to be replaced.
Today I was pleasantly surprised though by the Fuji X100. It could be just the right camera for me at this time. It seems to beat many of the features of the X1 and provides a more "classic" shooting experience compaired to the m4/3 options. If the price is around the X1 mark I will be very interested. I might reconsider trading in my 7D for one.
In any case I think it is the best "poor man's Leica" so far.

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Canon 7D | EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS

Thanks Dutch! It definitely was a great experience to shoot with the M9 and 50 Lux. Pure quality, a truly delightful instrument.

- Bjorn -

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Street and documentary photographer | Google+ | Twitter | Blog | Tumblr

Leica M9-P (my article on Camera Labs) | Leica D-Lux 5 | 50mm Summilux

You could always get one of these.

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Nikon D5000 and D300 with 12-24mm, 35mm f1.8, 50mm f1.4, 60mm f2.8 Macro, 18-200mm, 17-55mm f2.8 (all Nikon)

No thanks. I want the real thing...

- Bjorn -

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Street and documentary photographer | Google+ | Twitter | Blog | Tumblr

Leica M9-P (my article on Camera Labs) | Leica D-Lux 5 | 50mm Summilux

Same here!

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Canon 7D | EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS

Hi Dutch!

My father is about to sell his M3, and some Leica glass as well. I can see that even a second hand M3 and one lens can exceed $1000, but Leicas are expensive.

I've heard pretty good things about the X1, except there've been some complaints about the grey parts and the AF. Otherwise, it's a good camera.

Have you considered the Finepix X100? It looks like it's going after the X1, and it's going to do a good job.

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-Evan

Gear: 7 Nikon Nikkor AI-S and AF-S lenses, SB-700 flash, Nikon D7000, Nikon FM, variety of accessories

"There are no rules for good photographs, there are only good photographs."
- Ansel Adams

Hi EvanK,

Yes, the X100 is very interesting and I am considering it above the X1. There are several reasons why the X100 seems more attractive.

When the X1 came out I was slightly disappointed. I never understood why Leica chose not to put the aperture and focus rings on the lens, why it had no built in viewfinder and why the lens was f/2.8 rather than f/2. They were not big remarks, more like wish-list remarks, but the X100 gives exactly those things.

Yes the Leica looks better, and let's face it, it is a Leica, but I cannot help but feel that the X100 is more a photographers camera than the X1. That is what I am after. I want to have full control of the camera and not dig through menus. A Leica M would be the best choice, but is too expensive. The X100 is the first I have seen to come really close to an M without the very high price tag.

Of course I still have to see how things are financially when the X100 comes out. If I can't afford one I will seriously consider trading in my 7D if the X100 delivers what it promises. There is still plenty of time though and I am in no rush anyway.

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Canon 7D | EF-S 17-55 f/2.8 IS

It's been a while. but that's mainly because i shoot more film then digital these days. Although i bought a Canon S95 recently. A wonderful little camera, with a lot a functionality.

@Bjorn
Nice story of you the handling M9. It's no shame to get blurred pics at 1/8. Even with a rangefinder (Leica or not) it's pretty hard, to not get any blurred pics at that speed. I found your remark of the low-res display very amusing. On a Digital M, you don't need a high-res display for viewing your images. The VF on the M shows everything you need. And with the knowledge of the settings you used and knowing that the rangefinder is accurate. The pic will come out just like you wanted (unless you did something wrong).

@EvanK
I'm still looking for some glass, especially a 35mm. Is your dad selling any ?

Like I said earlier, I've been shooting mostly film lately (50 rolls so far) besides the Zeiss Ikon I already had. I recently bought a Leica CL. The CL is a Leica designed camera, build by minolta in japan. And it's almost 40 years old, and still working great. How many DSLR will reach that age and still work.
Re-reading this post I saw a couple of remarks saying "I want to keep the digital workflow" Well after shooting film for a year now, I can say I'm really happy that I made the change. Yes, it's sometimes boring to scan your films, and it takes some time to scan them. But I'm very happy with the results so far.
Here is a pic from the first film i shot with the Leica CL.

Here (F044-014) by HoodedOne, on Flickr

I feel there is still a lot to learn for me. And not only with using the cameras, but also how to scan the images.
One of the best advantages of shooting film, is that you don't have to worry to much of loosing your image. The negative is the perfect backup.

But one thing that I value above everything else, is that I have much more pleasure in photography. And both cameras, are cameras that I want to take with me on a daily basis. And not like the DSLR, lying in a drawer waiting to get used.
For me it worked out nicely, this switch to film. I cannot say if it will for anybody else, but I would certainly gif it a try. Even if it is with an old film SLR and a single lens (they are really cheap these days).

cheers,
Hans

ps. there is a nice site covering this film/digital hybrid workflow. http://figitalrevolution.com/ go there and listen to some of his audio blogs (the last 2 are really nice)

Hans, I agree it's not necessary to instantly review your photos, especially not on an M, that's a part of the whole experience. However, what I like to do, and it's part of my digital upbringing I guess, is to sit down after, say, a walk through the city, and have a look at the images I've shot. On a €5500,- camera, I'd expect a 921k display for that purpose.
It's only a minor con to the wonderful M9 though, one that I'll definitely manage to overcome when finally getting to use it. And perhaps Leica will even equip the M10 (or M9.2) with a high resolution display...

Also, if you (Hans) and EvanK's dad are interested in buying/selling, please do so via PM, the forum may not be used for selling equipment.

- Bjorn -

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Street and documentary photographer | Google+ | Twitter | Blog | Tumblr

Leica M9-P (my article on Camera Labs) | Leica D-Lux 5 | 50mm Summilux