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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 9:07 am 
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Hi folks,

You can read all about the M at Leica's various web-sites (here for example) but sometimes a movie is worth a thousand words. Check out the promotional video on Vimeo (click the image below):

    Image

There's also some interesting reading plus illustrations in the product brochure (PDF) on the new CMOS sensor and the the microlens array:

    in the case of the Leica max 24 mP sensor, and in contrast to standard CmoS sensors, even light rays with large angles of incidence, e.g. from wide-angle lenses or large apertures, are captured precisely by the photodiodes of the sensor. This is enabled by the special microlens design and the smaller distance between the colour filter and photodiode, which allows more light to enter the system, and ensures that it falls more directly on the respective photodiodes.

It's hard to imagine how Leica could have announced a better camera within the constraints of the manual focus M-system lenses. Maybe they'll add sensor based image stabilisation one day but photographers managed without it for years and many still do. Looks like my sixty-fifth birthday present to myself has been decided - fortunately I still have a few years to go in which to save up some pennies! :twisted: :lol:

Bob.

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:13 pm 
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Hi folks,

I've just been reading the CMOSIS press release about the new sensor for the M. They quote "a linear full well capacity of ≥40,000 electrons and a linear dynamic range close to 76dB". If those numbers were all that defined IQ then the sensor would seem to lag a little behind the competition, as can be inferred from the graphs here and here at Clarkvision. But that's assuming the figures are derived in the same way and also how much benefit one actually sees above and beyond a certain level of performance except with unusually demanding subject matter?

Somehow I doubt the reviews and sample images, when we finally get to see them as the current cameras are all pre-production, will be anything less than glowing. Er, that's the reviews that will be glowing, not the images! :P :lol:

Bob.

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Leica D Vario-Elmar 14mm-150mm f/3.5 - f/5.6 ASPH.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:23 pm 
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its nice that they've made a bigger screen...but its not nice to remove the thumb wheel of where it used to be and have that as a thumb scroll instead.

I also prefer the round buttons to the new flat rectangular ones... they should have kept the original design but with a larger screen

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PostPosted: Tue Sep 18, 2012 1:41 pm 
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I think we have to play a game that the measurement methods must be the same to be comparable.

76dB would translate to a dynamic range of about 12.6 stops, which is comparable to Canon sensors but possibly lagging compared to the Sony based sensors based on DxO results. But the Canon and Sony sensors on Clarkvision site have much higher SNR values which don't compare to DxO. E.g. DxO rate the 5D2 as 11.9 stops. Clarkvision chart come out about 104 dB, or 17 stops, but if you look at the table lower down, that gives 14.7 stops instead. That inconsistency, unless I'm missing something here, makes me take their results with a huge amount of caution so I wouldn't use that as a basis for comparison.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 20, 2012 9:41 am 
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Hi folks,

A detailed hands-on preview of the M can be found at the Red Dot site. The M looks better and better although I do note a little wailing and gnashing of teeth amongst some ultra-traditionalists. Having downsized to a pocketable CSC earlier this year I'm in no hurry to bulk up again but of all this year's full-frame announcements the M gets my vote. The M9 felt very good in my hands when I tried it last year (far nicer than my old 5D2) and the M just builds on that by adding a whole raft of extra options which can either be used or ignored at will. 8)

Bob.

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Leica D Vario-Elmar 14mm-150mm f/3.5 - f/5.6 ASPH.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 01, 2012 8:55 pm 
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It would be interesting to know what Bjorn's reaction was to the launch of the M and M-E models. In particular, would he still choose his M9-P?


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 10, 2012 7:21 pm 
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I'm interested in your reply Bjorn because I am still considering a move to Leica myself, although more for landscape than street.


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:59 am 
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Hi folks,

TCS has a great video review of the "M" here. Enjoy. 8)

Bob.

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Leica D Vario-Elmar 14mm-150mm f/3.5 - f/5.6 ASPH.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:00 pm 
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Sorry for the very late reply warth man, I must have missed this thread when it was active in November. I could write a long story, which I don't really feel like doing at the moment, so I'll say: I don't like what Leica did with their new models. In fact, I am writing my master thesis on their 'bad move'. The new features should not be part of a Leica camera (in case of the M), and the M-E should not be positioned as the lower-end model. In a couple months I'll have my thesis ready with a more elaborate (and scientific :wink: ) explanation for my dislike of these models.

I am still very happy with my M9-P, and wouldn't trade it for one of these new models because a camera is just an instrument. The M9-P works for me, it does what I need it to do, that is: not get in my way of creative expression. A camera is the least important element for photography (90% photographer, 6% lens, 4% camera, or something along those lines). Now had Leica come out with the M Monochrom a little earlier, I might have gotten that instead. Most of my work is in B/W anyway and I wouldn't mind the high ISO performance on that model. But again, it doesn't matter. I'm perfectly satisfied with my M9-P and will continue using it for many years to come.

- Bjorn

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PostPosted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:19 pm 
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Thank you for responding Bjorn. Your comments are interesting, especially those about the M-E as it is supposed to be a "budget" M9 minus a couple of minor elements. I admit to keeping an eye on M9-P prices here in the UK but it is becoming increasingly difficult to see any at all. I'll keep looking - and wondering - for now.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:48 am 
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Hi folks,

A couple of reviews of the '240', found courtesy of Leica Rumors.


Some very positive words there, particularly about the IQ of the new sensor. Looking in from the outside I'm a bit confused about the reaction to the 240 from some. If it is possible, as I believe it is, to turn off pretty much all of the new-fangled stuff (to Leica) like live view and use the 240 as a traditional rangefinder then why wouldn't you want to take advantage of the (allegedly) better IQ from the new sensor?

Update: Also check out I will not buy that camera, I promise... over at LL. A win for the '240' over the D800E so far as IQ is concerned.

Bob.

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Leica D Vario-Elmar 14mm-150mm f/3.5 - f/5.6 ASPH.
OM-D E-M5, H-PS14042E, Gitzo GT1541T, Arca-Swiss Z1 DP ball-head.
Astrophotography: TEC 140 'scope, FLI ML16803 camera, ASA DDM60 Pro mount.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2013 2:08 pm 
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Hi guys,

I haven't been active lately as Ive been focusing on creating lesson plans and teaching. Lately Ive been following the Leica M and as a layperson who has played with an M9 for a few hours, I come from the "fresh" faced view of Leica cameras. I agree with Bjorn that its not a camera that follows what the M represents, but to be honest, as someone who is 20% in terms of saving for a Leica and 50mm summilcron, I prefer Leica to innovate and add, and whilst I don't share the "bad move" view because Im not a die hard fan, I am an avid street photographer and the Leica to me, represents something I can never get with my 7D and set of lenses.

What are people's views on the new M as JUST a rangefinder - does it do what all the Ms do? Does it still have the Leica sharpness and is the camera faster to use? I still remember how the M9 took a picture and the buffer was still processing as I took the second picture and waited for the first image to appear on the LCD (I wasn't chimping, I wanted to see if I was any good at Leica focusing.)

Also, feel free to treat me like someone who doesn't know anything about Leica, I know I want an M, I'll even buy it second hand if I have to - but I only know about the Leica experience from the one person who was kind enough to let me use his Leica for a while, and since then I have dreamed in focus patches.

So in short, should I just get a M-E, M9 or M? since people are recently saying how disappointing the new M is.

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PostPosted: Sat Aug 10, 2013 10:34 am 
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    Image

      Leica M 240 – Hands-on Review by Kai (DigitalRev)

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:05 am 
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I know Bjorn will disagree with me, but I think that Kai's review settled my decision for me.

As a "new to the fold" member of Leica fandom, I have accepted the new M as a definitive step forward for innovation in the land of Leica. Its still far behind but it also looks to the future.

This is the review that made me put my order for a new M. Sadly Im on a 6 month waiting list.

I tried one, and imo, for the money Im spending, I kinda appreciate the extra Dynamic Range - and it shoots my 7D image quality, DR and sharpness out of the water. This is kinda what I wanted with my first step into my first FF camera too.

Kai's review IMO, addresses the problems, the positives but also addresses the leica loyal's perceptions of it, and I think Im ok with that. I still think the CCD sensor is sharper and has a particular colour pallet I preffer when it comes to muting colours. But I love the Vibrance and the new look. I guess to some fans, I don't know what Im talking about - mainly cause I don't, Im new to this world and Im kinda excited - knowing that Im entering with a camera that people are either happy or hating - and since this is my first FF and first RF and first Leica.... Im going to try and keep an open mind.

I will say one thing that leica got right - even if you disagree this is the right change for leica M, the one thing it gets 110% correct is getting people like me who want a Leica Experience but was put off by the outdated technology (buffer and screen - not the RF system itself) this new M made me pass on the M-E, M9 and decide that I DO want a new screen, electronic aids, Live view, I DO want focus assists, and digital framelines and I also DO want the RF experience too, with the ability to have Video IF I really need it. Leica offered it and I was in the market for one, and now, Leica has a camera for me.

I hope that Leica still makes a "true" RF like the M9 but future looking, alongside the fact that Leica understands that to stay alive, it also needs to show its progress in the new technological era of cameras.

Leo

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 9:02 am 
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News from Australia - Leica raised the price of the Leica M from $7995 to $8495 (Australian Dollars) despite pre-orders made months ago (me among one of them)

Slightly disappointing.

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